"About 150 pages of the 430-page budget deal with changing the federal government’s approach to the environment.

These include replacing the entire Canadian Environmental Assessment Act and significantly altering the Fisheries Act.

Normally these changes would go before Parliament’s environment and fisheries committees for study and public feedback, and then to the entire House of Commons for a final vote. But because they are part of the budget, the finance committee alone will study the whole document."

I'm interested in knowing how Conservative defenders actually respond to this. There's no question, if a majority provincial government (one that could rule without opposition) decided to throw into their budget, "Decrease post-secondary education, and reduce any sort of post-secondary standards and regulations on education", then every single student in here would be outraged and say, "Why are you deciding this in the budget!? This should be properly reviewed elsewhere". Yet I feel like Conservative supporters are going to double-standard this one and say, "This is where all environmental decisions should be made: By economics majors."... I mean, hey, the Conservatives actually said it themselves: "Michelle Rempel, the parliamentary secretary to the environment, said the bill will be scrutinized under a finance subcommittee “where it belongs.”'

http://thechronicleherald.ca /canad...onment-process

Because a bunch of responses are going to try and discredit this by saying, "You know the budget in question is federal, not provincial, right?". My response: I know. That's not the point at all. If that's your first argument/first thing that comes to mind, then don't bother responding to this post... Your input is not well thought out. And same goes to those of you who are going to try and lead the discussion to another issue. It's a Harper tactic, I know: Point elsewhere so you can continue doing your dirty thing...

I dont really understand anything about acts and all that stuff but I honestly cannot understand how Canadians continue to vote for this complete joke of a PM... Stephan Harper

In summary, the budget has to be passed annually. Normally small policy changes are the most that would appear in the budget, and if the budget is passed, then those policy changes included within, would also be passed. What SHOULDN'T be included is policy that requires special attention and review, and massive overhauls of Canadian law and regulation.

What Stupid Harper has done is rolled all of his aspirations and dreams into the new budget which is guaranteed to be passed under his Majority (read: Dictator) rule. Calls for him to separate his aspirations to overhaul environmental law from budget matters have gone ignored, and he says they will continue to go ignored. (Note: I say "dictator" as a personal opinion, but the title is pretty accurate, given the Supreme Leader's/Harper's ignorance of public opinion)

What a bill, act, or any similar motion (including this one) will have to go through is a review committee. Since this is a budget, a financial review committee will go through and approve or disapprove of the financial changes within. They will not provide commentary on items which do not concern them (as economists, politicians, etc., the environmental changes do not concern them).

So Harper's dreams will get a free pass, without exposure to Canadians, and the students here (who I am most interested in hearing from), will continue to support Harper because the issues are not being made front and center as most Canadians need them to be, in order for them to be aware. Heck, there are some who have been slapped left right and center with information about the issues, and still can't decipher what's actually going on...

It's a whole lot more than disheartening. It's a commentary on intelligence.

it was expected that conservatives would give less crap about enviro and more enviro while cuttin this and cuttin that then imposing more taxes and fees for trade, war etc

I'm not sure I understood most of that. I see a string of keywords.

It's interesting that none of those typical hard core Conservative posters have backed up any of these Conservative actions.

I consider my self centralist bordering on conservative and voted for them last election. soo
1) i disagree with the conservatives on this. There SHOULD be some sort of economic handle on the environment. You could easily pour the entire nations gdp into it and see minimal gain. That being said, anything involving tax monies or major political issues such as the environment should be properly debated within the house and in most cases the senate. Not a private committee.

2) Harper, or any previous PM are in fact figureheads to the party they are head of. Any major decision, particularly involving budget, would be the decision of all major members of the ruling party. Im not defending harper or the conservatives; there recent work has been rather unfortunate. However throwing accusations at a single person would be incorrect.

Just to throw it out there: the last decent budget the federal gov has put out was under Chretien with martin as finance minister.

I don't consider myself a supporter of any party (as I have previously stated before), but maybe it's your constant posts bashing Conservatives to incite debate, even though we know that your view (and theirs, for that matter) is never going to change on the subjects being discussed, that makes them shy away from commenting on posts such as these.

The above is not much of a commentary on the original topic. I posted an issue regarding a political topic, because most of the rest of Canada seems oblivious to these ENORMOUS issues. I asked to hear from the Conservative people, as to how they can defend these actions. If their response has no merit, or if it's based on completely incorrect information, then I'll argue it because I'm looking for an answer that tells me why these actions are accepted by enough people for the Conservatives to have obtained a "majority".

Let's not even get onto the topic again regarding the fact that less than a majority of voters support these fools... I just want to hear the justification for the current issue, from those that do support the Conservatives.

voting for a party does not mean you support them entirely. Stop attacking by saying that voting for them at the time means they need to defend every single decision they made. In addition, many 'conservatives' are centralists who support some things conservative/right and some more liberal/left. They vote based on the basic platform suggested, weight the pros and cons of each and then decide.

Looking at the parties you have conservative, liberal, NDP, green, and bloc. Now assuming ontario, Bloc is not an option. The green party has an overly focused platform and is essentially an abstaining vote at this time, so they are not really an option for a lot of people. Now most centralists view more radical parties less than appealing. Meaning many centralists or anyone with and tendencies at all toward right would hesitate to vote NDP. That leaves the liberals and the conservatives. In this election the liberals had shaky leadership amplified by the conservatives attack adds. Combine with the belief that a number of years of minority government provided an image of political instability in canada to the world as well as international businesses. Some people voted conservative because they were by far the best chance to bring back a stable majority government.

^agreed, thats why i stay out. the op (in general) is passionate about a topic, so arguing is pointless.

Originally Posted by Snowman

^agreed, thats why i stay out. the op (in general) is passionate about a topic, so arguing is pointless.

This is, in essence, what I was saying. When you're passionate about a subject, especially politics, why even bother debating? Nothing changes in the end.

The fact of the matter is that nobody actually cares about the environment (despite what some of us claim). We all drive gas guzzling cars, keep filling up landfills with garbage, use electronics/electricity, etc, etc.

We as Canadians made 1 issue that was priority in the last election....jobs, jobs, jobs and the economy. This issue will still be priority in the next U.S. and Canadian elections. Environmental issues always take a backseat because we're to worried about employment, tuition fees, housing/gas prices, etc.

If we actually cared about the environment, we would all vote Green Party and start living in the Stone Age again. We need to stop blaming the Government when we're the ones who voted them in and told them the issues that were priority.

"I'm interested in knowing how Conservative defenders actually respond to this."

Every subsequent post I have made, I have expressed this.

I think I have my answer though... There isn't a single Conservative voter that supports the Conservatives actions on this part. It's an enormous issue, and no one is defending it outside the House of Commons. Heck, there seems to be a bit of embarrassment with regards to defending the Conservatives after this.

Interesting reactions any ways... All the off-topic comments diverting from the original topic/concern still speaks volumes about the actual topic at hand. As I focus on it because I'm passionate about these serious issues, no one else wants to focus on defending it.

But when the next election rolls around (if we're still a democracy), and a tonne of people still support Conservative, I'll be dumbfounded (but honestly, not even surprised any more)... Such enormous political disasters can take place, Conservative voters can't defend those disastrous actions, and yet they will continue to vote that way because they remain uninformed.

I think the only really informed person in Canada any more is Stephen Harper... He knows where it's at: 'NDP didn’t support war against Hitler’ --- Stephen Harper. http://news.nationalpost.com /2012/...istory-lesson/

Lol, so embarrassing...

Originally Posted by Allan

We need to stop blaming the Government when we're the ones who voted them in and told them the issues that were priority.

If there's one thing I won't tolerate, it's being accused of voting Conservative. I refuse to be labelled as uninformed, and ignorant of a much more complex world...

Anyone that was concerned about "jobs, jobs, jobs" only, clearly doesn't have a handle on a far greater network that works with and against jobs... And again, I refuse to be labelled as that kind of person.

Again, I must point out that less than half of the voting population put these idiots in power. So I'm even sceptical that "we're the ones who told them the issues that were priority". If anything, we told them that the economy was not a priority, considering more than half of voters voted in other directions.

Given a majority government, here's how a Prime Minister should look at it: Did over 50% vote us in? --> No ---> My campaign priorities need to be re-evaluated: Which ones were voters actually concerned about? What issues did other parties raise that won THEM votes.

Granted,
Did over 50% vote us in? --> Yes ---> My campaign priorities are important to a majority of voting citizens. Carry on.

Originally Posted by mike_302

If there's one thing I won't tolerate, it's being accused of voting Conservative. I refuse to be labelled as uninformed, and ignorant of a much more complex world...

Given a majority government, here's how a Prime Minister should look at it: Did over 50% vote us in? --> No ---> My campaign priorities need to be re-evaluated: Which ones were voters actually concerned about? What issues did other parties raise that won THEM votes.

Granted,
Did over 50% vote us in? --> Yes ---> My campaign priorities are important to a majority of voting citizens. Carry on.

The point I'm trying to make is that we as Canadians voted in our Government. (Regardless of whether you voted Conservative, NDP, Liberal, etc.). That means we as Canadians also need to accept responsibility/blame for the decisions that our government makes. When I say government, that includes all elected officials of all parties.

Now, being the PM of a minority government...of course he should re-evaluate his platform and his position on some issues. However, re-evaluating doesn't necessarily mean he should change his platform or his position. If Canadians don't like the PM's decisions this term, then he won't be re-elected as PM next term...plain and simple.

You haven't really presented any solutions to the problems you suggested, and simply seem to be criticizing. I don't blame people for being ignorant and uninformed...most people simply vote for the issues that concern them...and who they feel will best address them. However, since you claim that you're not ignorant/uninformed, I'm sure you'll make a great PM one day, and that your party will always have a majority government, and you'll make the right decisions on complex issues all the time.