Since I love debate, I'm going to post this question and then observe the discussion... I'm going to participate only after the discussion has progressed somewhat.

Q: Do you think humans have a fundamental right to food, water and healthcare, or any one or combination of the three? Why, or why not? Please use any and all arguments/reasoning... and don't get personal.

Enjoy!

I believe in the principle of "treat others the way you want to be treated". Would I want to be able to access basic necessities such as food, water, and health care? Yes, then I expect the same to be applied to others.


http://www.un.org/en/documents/udhr/ <3

Nobody has any sort of intrinsic "right" to anything, however I think we should extend empathy and human decency to those who are in need of such things. Not because they have a "right" to it, but because its the compassionate thing to do, and you would like the same if you were ever in their position.

Originally Posted by ViktorVaughn

Nobody has any sort of intrinsic "right" to anything, however I think we should extend empathy and human decency to those who are in need of such things. Not because they have a "right" to it, but because its the compassionate thing to do, and you would like the same if you were ever in their position.

I like this answer.

Food, water, clothing, shelter, companionship are all basic human needs that we cannot live without. It is about survival. God has given us the resources to fulfill these needs. There is enough for all of us. Hence, there is no reason for conflict on the matter of it being a fundamental right of every individual. Would you deny food to your brother?

Originally Posted by ZZZZZZZZ

Food, water, clothing, shelter, companionship are all basic human needs that we cannot live without. It is about survival. God has given us the resources to fulfill these needs. There is enough for all of us. Hence, there is no reason for conflict on the matter of it being a fundamental right of every individual. Would you deny food to your brother?

There is actually not enough food if people keep on supporting organic foods. I don't see why so many people are against genetically modified foods.

According to one of the many articles from population ecology (the courseware is in Hamilton, atm or I would get the authors), at the moment the "famine problem" is an issue of food distribution not food production.

Organic food tastes better and it's better for the environment in many cases. The problem with GMO foods is that it can reduce diversity in the types of crops that we have. We can create crops that are incredibly resistent to different types of fungi to yield more produce, which is good. But a problem arises if this crop starts to monopolize the agriculture industry and another pest manages to wipe out the entire yield. Conserving biodiversity, even within species, is so important.

Note: I'm just playing Devil's advocate, I really don't care if my food is GM'ed or not.

Originally Posted by Jay

Organic food tastes better

You should watch the Penn & Teller: Bullshit episode on Organic Food... using a double-blind taste test they determine that "normal" food is often chosen as the food with the better flavour. There's a lot of things wrong with organic food... it's not a viable solution to anything... if anything it's more harmful.

As devil's advocate I'll state this: as compassionate as anyone might be, things such as food, water or healthcare must be provided by people, who need to make livings themselves. How do you solve the problem of "does this person make a living, or does this other person eat/drink/heal"?

You should watch the Penn & Teller: Bullshit episode on Organic Food... using a double-blind taste test they determine that "normal" food is often chosen as the food with the better flavour. There's a lot of things wrong with organic food... it's not a viable solution to anything... if anything it's more harmful.

I've grown organic tomatoes in my backyard - no pesticides and natural fertilizers (compost). I don't see how that's harmful to my health. I do, however, agree with the idea that there are still problems with organic foods - such as the lack of standardization.

Once again, it's important to think critically when watching media reports. Their Food Policy Analyst Expert”, Alex Avery, is paid by the Hudson Institute. This institute is funded by giant corporations such as Monsanto, the leading producer of genetically engineered (GE) food.

I'm not saying that we should dismiss their study; however, you need to take it with a grain of salt.

In some cases, where there are dictatorships it's virtually impossible to survive on their own abilities. In North Korea, with the current system, even if a grandparent or a great grandparent disobeys or insults the "Great Leader" then you are automatically shunted to the bottom caste. This makes it very hard to survive under oppressive regimes without any sort of assistance.

While ideally people should make living on their own, sometimes people just need help in order to help to get them to that point.

I believe every person on this planet has certain rights, a la the Universal Declaration of Human Rights, which came into existence after WWII.

However, many countries (including Canada) do not meet the standards of the UDHR.

Hence why the Declaration for the Rights of Indigenous People was developed in 2007. Canada, the US, Australia and New Zealand all refused to sign.

Originally Posted by Jay

I've grown organic tomatoes in my backyard - no pesticides and natural fertilizers (compost). I don't see how that's harmful to my health. I do, however, agree with the idea that there are still problems with organic foods - such as the lack of standardization.

Once again, it's important to think critically when watching media reports. Their Food Policy Analyst Expert”, Alex Avery, is paid by the Hudson Institute. This institute is funded by giant corporations such as Monsanto, the leading producer of genetically engineered (GE) food.

I'm not saying that we should dismiss their study; however, you need to take it with a grain of salt.

In some cases, where there are dictatorships it's virtually impossible to survive on their own abilities. In North Korea, with the current system, even if a grandparent or a great grandparent disobeys or insults the "Great Leader" then you are automatically shunted to the bottom caste. This makes it very hard to survive under oppressive regimes without any sort of assistance.

While ideally people should make living on their own, sometimes people just need help in order to help to get them to that point.

Ben never said it wasn't good for your health. He was simply saying that with a double blind taste test, GM'd food was preferred over organic food.

Another problem with organic food is that third world countries will never be able to afford them since actual yield is low (crop failures, pests, etc...) meaning that prices will ALWAYS be high.

^ "if anything it's more harmful."


Edited:

Hence why the Declaration for the Rights of Indigenous People was developed in 2007. Canada, the US, Australia and New Zealand all refused to sign.

: ( Unfortunately Indigenous people are subjected to so many double standards. People complain that they get better treatment, but considering that they were subjected to residential schools and a lot of them have lost their traditional culture - the government isn't doing enough in my opinion.

It takes a lot longer for the police to look for an Indigenous woman who's gone missing compared to a non-native woman. We haven't officially discussed it yet, however I think Mac's Amnesty group is going to continue to fight for Indigenous Rights. Last year, it was mostly the Stolen Sister's campaign and the Lubicon Cree.

Originally Posted by Jay

^ "if anything it's more harmful."

I think when he said "It's more harmful" he's referring to the overall effect of organic foods, meaning that you get less food per acre and even less actual yield.

I just saw this short documentary on this History of Human Rights, so I thought I'd re-open the thread and get your thoughts (on it or what has already been stated).

Human Rights Day is only a month (and a bit) away - December 10th.