"Mi Mods
So i noticed Grover's dp on here with the sign saying no fun, and its really starting to feel that the mods are here to stop any real conversation or debate. The infractions handed out on this website are ridiculous at the best of times. The constant posts in threads threatening infraction points are really hitting the spot too eh. I guess what im trying to say before i nod off, is back the fuck off already guys. Its clear that you guys get a chubby from every infraction point handed out, but ffs let the forum have some sense of fun (much to Grover's dismay)
"

Yeah. Things have gotten even worst on macinsiders. It is pretty amazingly bad. A couple years ago this was the place to do campaign for the election and really talk about stuff - now. NOPE.

Now macinsiders is completely garbage b/c people like Grover have no idea how to be a mod and do not know how to internet works. Just stop Grover, it isn't working out man.

In fact you can't even make a thread discussing why macinsiders is so far downhill, even that gets banned. surely that does not go against the COC. (Show me where it does)

Chad, control your mods or fire them all, they have no idea what they are doing, not even close, and you're letting them ruin your site.

People like BenDover et al (not picking on you just example) are just bad trolls.

Back in my day........ *waves stick* trolls and hated people didn't say shit that would upset mods enough, they were more tactful than that.

Pardon my stupidity - but what does "mi" mean?

Originally Posted by vpdltm

Pardon my stupidity - but what does "mi" mean?

Its the name of the site.


edit: Oh wait............... aghhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh you got me didnt you...

No online communities get better over time, that is a fact of the internet. Some of us try and fight the inevitable though, call us dreamers, call us heroes. But, less mods is something we can do as a community, the community makes the forum aftrall.

Originally Posted by andrew22

"Mi Mods
So i noticed Grover's dp on here with the sign saying no fun, and its really starting to feel that the mods are here to stop any real conversation or debate. The infractions handed out on this website are ridiculous at the best of times. The constant posts in threads threatening infraction points are really hitting the spot too eh. I guess what im trying to say before i nod off, is back the fuck off already guys. Its clear that you guys get a chubby from every infraction point handed out, but ffs let the forum have some sense of fun (much to Grover's dismay)
"

Yeah. Things have gotten even worst on macinsiders. It is pretty amazingly bad. A couple years ago this was the place to do campaign for the election and really talk about stuff - now. NOPE.

Now macinsiders is completely garbage b/c people like Grover have no idea how to be a mod and do not know how to internet works. Just stop Grover, it isn't working out man.

In fact you can't even make a thread discussing why macinsiders is so far downhill, even that gets banned. surely that does not go against the COC. (Show me where it does)

Chad, control your mods or fire them all, they have no idea what they are doing, not even close, and you're letting them ruin your site.

Yeah love how that thread got closed after a mod began mocking eh? The mods ruin a lot of the threads on MI.
And in regards to your comments Ryan, I dont consider myself a troll in the first place. Sure there are times where i bash people for making a stupid comment, but by putting any opinion online, you are willingly opening yourself to the comments/criticism of others. Do i make some posts regarding controversial topics? Fuck yeah i do. Why? Because it is those topics that can generate some really great, and sometimes heated debates. I think the topic of equality between sexes is an excellent example of this. there are such varying opinions and it is fun to be in those threads.

I got a message from Chad for one of my posts in another thread and he was saying that, since two MI community members reported my post, he immediately had to take it down to please the community. In this post, i was SARCASTICALLY stating that i would welcome an engineering faculty full of students who were pro-raping (like the songs in the book, but we wont get to that). I made that comment to prove how ridiculous a previous post had been. People on here are way to sensitive when it comes to content in posts, and they ruin the discussion. What is to stop myself and a friend from going through all the threads and reporting every post? If two of us report something as offensive, then using the logic previously expressed the moderators should take down every post.
Quit ruining MI with your poor moderating and Chad you should really look into getting rid of a couple of your mods *cough* *Grover*.

Originally Posted by andrew22

In fact you can't even make a thread discussing why macinsiders is so far downhill, even that gets banned. surely that does not go against the COC. (Show me where it does)

Chad, control your mods or fire them all, they have no idea what they are doing, not even close, and you're letting them ruin your site.

But you can make threads proclaiming "how far downhill MacInsiders has gone" without offering any constructive criticism or original feedback that isn't "moderation is the problem," like what you've been doing for the past two weeks.

Fire them all? I guess that could work. Who could forget such memorable, sustainable online communities, completely devoid of all supervision, like...

Uh...


And FYI, it's the first two sentences of the Code of Conduct, in case you missed it.

Originally Posted by Grover

But you can make threads proclaiming "how far downhill MacInsiders has gone" without offering any constructive criticism or original feedback that isn't "moderation is the problem," like what you've been doing for the past two weeks.

Fire them all? I guess that could work. Who could forget such memorable, sustainable online communities, completely devoid of all supervision, like...

Uh...


And FYI, it's the first two sentences of the Code of Conduct, in case you missed it.

Pretty sure that fire them all would imply hiring new moderators... whether or not you agree with the criticisms, it has been made pretty clear that MI is going over the top with taking down posts and restricting discussion in multiple threads. Its an issue that needs to be addressed

Originally Posted by BenDover

Pretty sure that fire them all would imply hiring new moderators.

Originally Posted by andrew22

But, less mods is something we can do as a community, the community makes the forum aftrall.

Not when you look at his accompanying post in the thread. It seems apparent that Andrew is for the disempowerment of rules and regulations. The less, the better.

Let's say he did imply hiring new moderators. What happens in the meantime? This isn't Chad's full-time job. Almost all of the moderators currently on staff have been so for at least two years. The others have been here far longer. Who would train all of these newly proposed moderators, and where would they find the time?

Someone in a managerial position can't just fire their entire team, even if they had problems with every one of them. It completely dissolves any sustainability, and they would have to pull extra hours in the meantime. The application process alone would take a month, and then add another month or so for training. This includes constantly reinforcing the behavior you as an administrator, want to see your moderators exhibit. That's what we are, after all- an extension of Chad's will when he cannot be present.

Originally Posted by BenDover

Yeah love how that thread got closed after a mod began mocking eh? The mods ruin a lot of the threads on MI.
And in regards to your comments Ryan, I dont consider myself a troll in the first place. Sure there are times where i bash people for making a stupid comment, but by putting any opinion online, you are willingly opening yourself to the comments/criticism of others. Do i make some posts regarding controversial topics? Fuck yeah i do. Why? Because it is those topics that can generate some really great, and sometimes heated debates. I think the topic of equality between sexes is an excellent example of this. there are such varying opinions and it is fun to be in those threads.

I got a message from Chad for one of my posts in another thread and he was saying that, since two MI community members reported my post, he immediately had to take it down to please the community. In this post, i was SARCASTICALLY stating that i would welcome an engineering faculty full of students who were pro-raping (like the songs in the book, but we wont get to that). I made that comment to prove how ridiculous a previous post had been. People on here are way to sensitive when it comes to content in posts, and they ruin the discussion. What is to stop myself and a friend from going through all the threads and reporting every post? If two of us report something as offensive, then using the logic previously expressed the moderators should take down every post.
Quit ruining MI with your poor moderating and Chad you should really look into getting rid of a couple of your mods *cough* *Grover*.

Just to clarify things in your mind, I was one of the people who reported that comment; Chad (et al) don't just willy nilly take down posts that people report. When reviewing a reported comment: they consider the explanation given in the reporting text box, consider the context and content of the original post itself, past history of the reported poster, and consider the person doing the reporting. If you and a friend went around reporting things that were offensive when they really, arguably, weren't, you'd quickly find yourself incurring more infraction points.

- I gave constructive criticism 100%: I said there should be less moderation.

- I generally mean less moderation (if someone is posting something way over the line liek death threats, blatant non-sarcastic threats/rapey talk/sexual harassment) then obvi that should be stopped, but what has been being stopped does not evne come close to that.

-RyanC reporting that is problem 1 (a weak community) problem 2 is that you close threads based on what sensitive people claim to not like, and not what is good for the community as a whole. The squeaky wheel gets the grease at macinsiders, sad.

- I propose going 1 full month with no mods. See what happens, increase moderation as needed after that. (it is a win-win, either Grover your position is proven to be needed, and I will understand, or your position will be seen as not needed and imposing and the community gets better)

Originally Posted by andrew22

- I propose going 1 full month with no mods. See what happens, increase moderation as needed after that. (it is a win-win, either Grover your position is proven to be needed, and I will understand, or your position will be seen as not needed and imposing and the community gets better)

We've had varying levels of moderation in the past on MI, we've found that both too much and too little moderation ends up being bad for the community. We currently attempt to strike a balance somewhere in the middle. Where people can feel free to joke around but aren't, for example, making jokes about rape.

If you have criticisms about about specific posts being taken down, you should bring it up with Chad. If there actually is a pattern of Grover overreacting and taking down things that he shouldn't, Chad has the authority to change that.

If Chad doesn't agree with you and you continue to feel oppressed by the rules of this site you're free to join the lively community at r/mcmaster, start your own community website where you get to make the rules, or just hang out on 4chan and enjoy the benefits of modless forums.

PS. I changed my response to the original MI Mods topic to make my mockery of his complaints more inclusive

Originally Posted by andrew22

- I gave constructive criticism 100%: I said there should be less moderation.

I don't want to argue semantics too much here, but typically you need to offer viable solutions in order for it to be considered "constructive criticism." And I've already demonstrated why less/no moderators is not considered one.

Originally Posted by andrew22

-RyanC reporting that is problem 1 (a weak community) problem 2 is that you close threads based on what sensitive people claim to not like, and not what is good for the community as a whole. The squeaky wheel gets the grease at macinsiders, sad.

The main reason the reporting system exists is to bring troublesome posts to a moderator's attention that they otherwise may not have seen. This site has a lot of information to pore over, and some staff members have more or less time than others. In addition, the reporting tool hands over moderation to the hands of the people, in a sense. We do our best to delete as little as possible because it's clear that freedom of speech is valued here. For this reason, we rely heavily on the community to tell us what the majority consider being crude or offensive (unless it's painfully obvious that a post is deliberately trying to break the rules).

I understand that some will argue that this creates a "tyranny of the majority" scenario, but we do read into the details of the reports, and anyone who misuses the tool as a means to censor others unjustly doesn't last on here long.

Originally Posted by andrew22

- I propose going 1 full month with no mods. See what happens, increase moderation as needed after that. (it is a win-win, either Grover your position is proven to be needed, and I will understand, or your position will be seen as not needed and imposing and the community gets better)

I think you forget that this is an organization just as much as it is a community, and it has an image to uphold.

Originally Posted by Grover

Not when you look at his accompanying post in the thread. It seems apparent that Andrew is for the disempowerment of rules and regulations. The less, the better.

Let's say he did imply hiring new moderators. What happens in the meantime? This isn't Chad's full-time job. Almost all of the moderators currently on staff have been so for at least two years. The others have been here far longer. Who would train all of these newly proposed moderators, and where would they find the time?

Someone in a managerial position can't just fire their entire team, even if they had problems with every one of them. It completely dissolves any sustainability, and they would have to pull extra hours in the meantime. The application process alone would take a month, and then add another month or so for training. This includes constantly reinforcing the behavior you as an administrator, want to see your moderators exhibit. That's what we are, after all- an extension of Chad's will when he cannot be present.

So basically then you have a 2 month period to clean up your act before the new mods come to MI? What you are basically saying is that regardless of whether or not the mods here are doing a decent job, it would take to much time to train new moderators. Therefore you are saying that you can continue on being a detriment to MI with your over-moderating of posts and threads, with no threat of losing your job as a result? Thats a bit too much job security in my opinion.

Originally Posted by RyanC

Just to clarify things in your mind, I was one of the people who reported that comment; Chad (et al) don't just willy nilly take down posts that people report. When reviewing a reported comment: they consider the explanation given in the reporting text box, consider the context and content of the original post itself, past history of the reported poster, and consider the person doing the reporting. If you and a friend went around reporting things that were offensive when they really, arguably, weren't, you'd quickly find yourself incurring more infraction points.

If they are considering the person doing the reporting, they would have realized that you are far to overly sensitive. So i dont believe that comment. Also, I would love to hear any reasoning you have for downvoting that post, as it was clearly an over the top use of sarcasm, and if you really took that post literally then you need to grasp the difference between a serious post and a sarcastic one. Using the excuse that my sarcasm involved rape also cant be a reason for reporting, as the entire thread revolved around a song book that deals with lyrics involving rape.

Originally Posted by Tailsnake

We've had varying levels of moderation in the past on MI, we've found that both too much and too little moderation ends up being bad for the community. We currently attempt to strike a balance somewhere in the middle. Where people can feel free to joke around but aren't, for example, making jokes about rape.

If you have criticisms about about specific posts being taken down, you should bring it up with Chad. If there actually is a pattern of Grover overreacting and taking down things that he shouldn't, Chad has the authority to change that.

If Chad doesn't agree with you and you continue to feel oppressed by the rules of this site you're free to join the lively community at r/mcmaster, start your own community website where you get to make the rules, or just hang out on 4chan and enjoy the benefits of modless forums.

PS. I changed my response to the original MI Mods topic to make my mockery of his complaints more inclusive

what joke was ever made? Again its a post using sarcasm to get across my point in a thread DEALING WITH RAPE. What person in their right mind would honestly welcome a world in which groups of people supported rape?

macinsiders can't into sarcasm lol.


try one month no mods. gooby pls. This is viable, there is only one way to find out if it is anyway.