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The thread about w.t.f. reminded me that Men face just as much, if not more discrimination and hardships as females because of their gender.




False accusation of rape. How many thousands of men have had their lives completely RUINED because of some lying mentally deranged woman? This is a lot more common than you think, you likely know a girl or two who has falsely accused someone of rape.
http://www.glennsacks.com/blog/?page_id=1334
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_r ape
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_a...d_sexual_abuse
"According to a nine-year study conducted by former Purdue sociologist Eugene J. Kanin, in over 40 percent of the cases reviewed, the complainants eventually admitted that no rape had occurred (Archives of Sexual Behavior, Vol. 23, No. 1, 1994). Kanin also studied rape allegations in two large Midwestern universities and found that 50 percent of the allegations were recanted by the accuser."





Disparity of custody battles in divorce and the horrible implications. The husband never gets more than the woman, either it's equal, or most likely the woman is favored heavily. Also read the statistics based on children raised in fatherless homes, it is shocking:
http://deltabravo.net/custody/stats.php




Criminal Sentencing, woman get off easier for their crimes:
http://works.bepress.com/gang_lee/5/




Work related injuries and deaths. Men get into many more injuries, you could say this is because more men work hard labour jobs, but think of all the lives lost...99% of everything you see, every building, lightpost, all the pavement, all benches and chairs and trees planted and lecture halls and libraries and bedrooms were BUILT and PUT THERE by MEN. Just something to think about...:
http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfoi_rates_2010hb.pdf




Social Support. Think of how many women's shelters and homeless women there are compared to men?
http://www.thereformedbuddhi st.com...-omission.html




Woman actually get paid more than men more often than not if they're working in the same line of work as their male counterparts, not if you take into account the raw wage gap which is stupid in the first place.
http://www.consad.com/content/report...l%20Report.pdf




Education. Boys fall behind more than girls do, education and educators are catering towards girls more now.




A Must Read Article.
http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rig...he-difference/

A hard truth:

A woman that isn't comfortable watching you masturbate shouldn't ahve sat next to you on the bus in the first place.

Originally Posted by RockerSocker

Please Share This Thread With Your Friends








The thread about w.t.f. reminded me that Men face just as much, if not more discrimination and hardships as females because of their gender.




False accusation of rape. How many thousands of men have had their lives completely RUINED because of some lying mentally deranged woman? This is a lot more common than you think, you likely know a girl or two who has falsely accused someone of rape.
http://www.glennsacks.com/blog/?page_id=1334
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_accusation_of_r ape
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/False_a...d_sexual_abuse
"According to a nine-year study conducted by former Purdue sociologist Eugene J. Kanin, in over 40 percent of the cases reviewed, the complainants eventually admitted that no rape had occurred (Archives of Sexual Behavior, Vol. 23, No. 1, 1994). Kanin also studied rape allegations in two large Midwestern universities and found that 50 percent of the allegations were recanted by the accuser."





Disparity of custody battles in divorce and the horrible implications. The husband never gets more than the woman, either it's equal, or most likely the woman is favored heavily. Also read the statistics based on children raised in fatherless homes, it is shocking:
http://deltabravo.net/custody/stats.php




Criminal Sentencing, woman get off easier for their crimes:
http://works.bepress.com/gang_lee/5/




Work related injuries and deaths. Men get into many more injuries, you could say this is because more men work hard labour jobs, but think of all the lives lost...99% of everything you see, every building, lightpost, all the pavement, all benches and chairs and trees planted and lecture halls and libraries and bedrooms were BUILT and PUT THERE by MEN. Just something to think about...:
http://www.bls.gov/iif/oshwc/cfoi/cfoi_rates_2010hb.pdf




Social Support. Think of how many women's shelters and homeless women there are compared to men?
http://www.thereformedbuddhi st.com...-omission.html




Woman actually get paid more than men more often than not if they're working in the same line of work as their male counterparts, not if you take into account the raw wage gap which is stupid in the first place.
http://www.consad.com/content/report...l%20Report.pdf




Education. Boys fall behind more than girls do, education and educators are catering towards girls more now.




A Must Read Article.
http://www.avoiceformen.com/mens-rig...he-difference/

I believe in equality... but some of your points are pretty flawed. Most of this is not about sex, but either how things worked biologically or socially. It's not that society hates men, its that men, like women, have a traditional role (though this is changing). The disparities reflect these differences in roles and expectations. I'm not saying it's right per se, but its not a conspiracy.

CUSTODY - The Mother is traditionally the one that stays at home and sees to the household duties. She is also the one that feeds the baby (at least if she nurses) early in life. The mother-child pair bond is thought to be one of the strongest in biology and psychologically important. It makes sense the mother tends to have the kids, and hence tends to get more. Remember the women had to leave the workforce to have the kids, and if she were to come back, might need to rebuild her career, essp if she had multiple children. The man, in contrast, usually is the one to work and support the family. Just because the parents separate does not mean this roles need to be changed - might even be better, making the experience less jarring for the children.

CRIMINAL SENTENCING - Women tend to commit different crimes from men. For example, there are far fewer female serial killers (the majority are white, middle-aged men actually), but probably more female shoplifters. Women tend to take less risks, and hence would probably avoid the worst crimes.

WORK INJURIES - Men CHOOSE to take these jobs, as do the women who are also workers. It has nothing to do with gender, except maybe a man might get more offers (tending to be physically stronger, these jobs tend to be male-dominated and more appealing to men than women, etc) and might be more inclined to take them.

SOCIAL SUPPORT - Probably related to the kids (see first point). Also, women are usually the ones on the bad end of domestic abuse (how many cases have you heard of the man being beaten up? Not as many I imagine). Plus there are some cultures that make it hard for a women to make it without a husband, but very few where the opposite happens (essp important in Canada, where there are so many cultures).

EDUCATION - Boys do tend to develop more slowly, but there are also the ones that tend to answer questions in class and interact more. Not to mentioned immature or struggling kids tend to get extra help after school, etc.

RAPE - Of course there are going to be false accusations. But on the reverse, how many times are women accused of cheating and treated like garbage, while a man can have multiple partners and be called a stud? Also how many women have had their lives ruined by some deranged man? Either you do not get pregnant and suffer psychological trauma, or you do and deal with either a baby for the rest of your life and the trauma, or the issue of aborting and the trauma. Also, its one thing to be accused, another to be convicted.

Those are all valid issues, why don't you start a men's issues club?

Originally Posted by britb

I believe in equality... but some of your points are pretty flawed. Most of this is not about sex, but either how things worked biologically or socially. It's not that society hates men, its that men, like women, have a traditional role (though this is changing). The disparities reflect these differences in roles and expectations. I'm not saying it's right per se, but its not a conspiracy.

Yes, but the root of many issues talked about and advocated by women's issues groups can be justified the same way: It's just "how things work biologically or socially"

Originally Posted by Tailsnake

Yes, but the root of many issues talked about and advocated by women's issues groups can be justified the same way: It's just "how things work biologically or socially"

Yeah, I was just trying to avoid getting misunderstood as hating men. I was just trying to point out the other sides of the issues that didn't seem to be considered.

Originally Posted by britb

I believe in equality... but some of your points are pretty flawed. Most of this is not about sex, but either how things worked biologically or socially. It's not that society hates men, its that men, like women, have a traditional role (though this is changing). The disparities reflect these differences in roles and expectations. I'm not saying it's right per se, but its not a conspiracy.

CUSTODY - The Mother is traditionally the one that stays at home and sees to the household duties. She is also the one that feeds the baby (at least if she nurses) early in life. The mother-child pair bond is thought to be one of the strongest in biology and psychologically important. It makes sense the mother tends to have the kids, and hence tends to get more. Remember the women had to leave the workforce to have the kids, and if she were to come back, might need to rebuild her career, essp if she had multiple children. The man, in contrast, usually is the one to work and support the family. Just because the parents separate does not mean this roles need to be changed - might even be better, making the experience less jarring for the children.

CRIMINAL SENTENCING - Women tend to commit different crimes from men. For example, there are far fewer female serial killers (the majority are white, middle-aged men actually), but probably more female shoplifters. Women tend to take less risks, and hence would probably avoid the worst crimes.

WORK INJURIES - Men CHOOSE to take these jobs, as do the women who are also workers. It has nothing to do with gender, except maybe a man might get more offers (tending to be physically stronger, these jobs tend to be male-dominated and more appealing to men than women, etc) and might be more inclined to take them.

SOCIAL SUPPORT - Probably related to the kids (see first point). Also, women are usually the ones on the bad end of domestic abuse (how many cases have you heard of the man being beaten up? Not as many I imagine). Plus there are some cultures that make it hard for a women to make it without a husband, but very few where the opposite happens (essp important in Canada, where there are so many cultures).

EDUCATION - Boys do tend to develop more slowly, but there are also the ones that tend to answer questions in class and interact more. Not to mentioned immature or struggling kids tend to get extra help after school, etc.

RAPE - Of course there are going to be false accusations. But on the reverse, how many times are women accused of cheating and treated like garbage, while a man can have multiple partners and be called a stud? Also how many women have had their lives ruined by some deranged man? Either you do not get pregnant and suffer psychological trauma, or you do and deal with either a baby for the rest of your life and the trauma, or the issue of aborting and the trauma. Also, its one thing to be accused, another to be convicted.

This is everything I was going to say. I want to point out that men though are disadvantaged, not in the systemic way that the OP believes, but moreso because of masculinity. There is immense pressure to be "a man" in society. There are strict guidelines on what men have to do. This can lead to emotional problems. We can also say the same abofeminityut, and that can be worse because of the systemic issues. As well, everywhere is a men's club basically..

Nowadays, everyone is oppressed in society. We've focused so much on other groups being oppressed, that the "oppressors" have often been outcast. It's a vicious, never-ending cycle.

Originally Posted by britb

Some of your points are pretty flawed. Most of this is not about sex, but either how things worked biologically or socially.

CUSTODY - The Mother is traditionally the one that stays at home and sees to the household duties. She is also the one that feeds the baby (at least if she nurses) early in life. The mother-child pair bond is thought to be one of the strongest in biology and psychologically important. It makes sense the mother tends to have the kids, and hence tends to get more. Remember the women had to leave the workforce to have the kids, and if she were to come back, might need to rebuild her career, essp if she had multiple children. The man, in contrast, usually is the one to work and support the family. Just because the parents separate does not mean this roles need to be changed - might even be better, making the experience less jarring for the children.

It doesn't matter who of the two is traditionally more with the children. Once there is a divorce, the one that keeps the children will have to work just as much to provide for them, so will one have more time than the other to take care of the kids? There is many tragic cases where abusive mothers win the case just to spend the child support on themselves.

Originally Posted by britb

WORK INJURIES - Men CHOOSE to take these jobs, as do the women who are also workers. It has nothing to do with gender, except maybe a man might get more offers (tending to be physically stronger, these jobs tend to be male-dominated and more appealing to men than women, etc) and might be more inclined to take them.

That's like saying that women all over the world choose to be housewives.

Originally Posted by britb

Women are usually the ones on the bad end of domestic abuse (how many cases have you heard of the man being beaten up? Not as many I imagine).

Men are less likely to report them due to embarrassment. Also women are more likely to emotionally/psychologically abuse children.

Originally Posted by britb

Boys do tend to develop more slowly, but there are also the ones that tend to answer questions in class and interact more. Not to mentioned immature or struggling kids tend to get extra help after school, etc.

The problem is not who develops first, but who is encouraged to develop. There is more women enrolled in university than men.

Originally Posted by britb

RAPE - Of course there are going to be false accusations.

Again, men are less likely to report it.

Originally Posted by britb

Also how many women have had their lives ruined by some deranged man? .

Also, how many men have had their lives ruined by gold diggers that were only after money?

I think its important to distinguish between gender discrimination and gender disparity. It isn't discriminatory that women get paid less then men and men face more danger, it's down to women and men having different priorities(disparity! =discrimination). It isn't discriminatory that both genders don't report rape as often as it occurs, it is up to those victims to determine if they have a provable case against the accused. It isn't discriminatory that there are more women support groups, its up to men to increase the demand for such support groups. Our school system isn't discriminatory against boys, its up to each individual to succeed or fail.

What IS discriminatory however is any case that even considers gender. A criminal is a criminal and should be punished according to the crime committed, differences in sentences base on gender alone ARE discriminatory. Custody of children going towards a female just because of "biological differences" is discriminatory, the only thing that should be considered is who is the more capable parent/guardian. Convicting someone without proof solely on one person's word is violating "innocent until proven guilty" and could point to gender discrimination.

what happened to this?
feminists (not including its international issues) anger me because supposedly there is this "system" built against them. I see the reality as these feminists think that women shouldn't hold any responsibility or agency over their own lives and that the "system" should always accommodate "them". Before there was a structure that was discriminatory towards women, the feminist movement got rid of that structure. Mission accomplished. That's it. But NO this women hating entity is still FORCING women to act in certain ways even though all equal (if not greater) rights have been granted to women.

Feminism used to be about women empowerment, now its about shifting all responsibility off of women. It's whiny and useless. The feminist movement should be about giving confidence to women to believe they are as capable as men (which they are), not telling them that there is this mystical system out there to **** them over every step in life.

I feel like the men's rights movement shouldn't be necessary. There shouldn't be any gender bias in our courts but somehow there is. I think its important to reveal the discrimination against men in custody battles, criminal punishment, military draft, and affirmative action and that's why I can support the men's rights movement. In places where structural discrimination actually exists against women (basically all of the "undeveloped" world) I support the women's rights movement but not in Canada.

if you can't see the systematic oppression facing women today from earning 70% of a man's pay, to the fact that 1 in 4 women will be sexually assaulted in their lifetime then you're not paying attention.

the way this patriarchal society we live in is structured makes these things structural and barely visible. they are so deep rooted in our society that you are blind to them. this country was built on a patriarchal ideology and this hegemonic view point is still rooted in society.

so you get no sympathy from me for playing the "OHNOES MENS R BEING OPPRESSED" card. i suppose you're going to ask for a white history month and white studies next?