Originally Posted by Alex McColl

Why is there a double standard where wearing fur is so much more evil than leather? Maybe it's because the cow was already dead since we eat beef

I think you hit the nail on the head there (the cows aren't cute part I think is a little far off).

We as a society use the entire cow for one reason or another (eat the meat/organs, bones go into supplements + gelatin, hide turns into leather, etc). Chinchillas and foxes (as far as I know) aren't being used for the meat, organs, teeth, etc. Killing an animal just for the fur (which is unnecessary since we have synthetic materials) is what some people see as wasteful and wrong. "Animal byproducts" used in most of our day-to-day lives generally come from animals which are used in their entirety.

I'm no PETA person by any means, I just think it's wasteful to kill an animal just for a single thing. If you're going to go into a business (such as the fur trade), at least use the rest of the animal for something!

Originally Posted by lorend

The list of all the clubs on campus is available here: https://www.msumcmaster.ca/clubs/lis...earchClubs.htm

However, that is the list since Januaryish 2009, so any new clubs for September 2009 are not included in that list.

You can email the Clubs Admin and ask if there are any of those clubs ratified for next September. If not, you can start your own club for January.

The ratified clubs list for 2009-2010 is here:

https://www.msumcmaster.ca/content/d...ubs%20List.pdf

(I know it says "to be ratified", but we ratified it already)

Originally Posted by Taunton

The ratified clubs list for 2009-2010 is here:

https://www.msumcmaster.ca/content/d...ubs%20List.pdf

(I know it says "to be ratified", but we ratified it already)

Thanks! Once the document becomes official can you send it to Chad or myself so we can post it officially on the front page?

Originally Posted by Taunton

The ratified clubs list for 2009-2010 is here:

https://www.msumcmaster.ca/content/d...ubs%20List.pdf

(I know it says "to be ratified", but we ratified it already)

As an addendum to Ben's comments, I should mention that there were a few amendments made to the list that are not reflected in this draft:

• McMaster Digital Games Group struck from the list
• Interactive Knights renamed to McMaster Gaming Association
• McMaster Chinese Engineering Society renamed to McMaster Chinese Engineering Society and Science
• McMaster Hispanic Society renamed to McMaster Organization of Latin American Students (OLAS)
• McMaster NDP Club (MacNDP) renamed to McMaster Campus New Democrats
• Unite for Sight renamed to Optometry Giving Sight

More information can be found in the minutes from the SRA 09D meeting on June 13. The list that Ben posted, plus these amendments, comprise the official document.

There's a difference between animal rights and PETA...

"Arson, property destruction, burglary and theft are 'acceptable crimes' when used for the animal cause." -Alex Pacheco, Director, PeTA

I'm likely to agree with Taunton's perspective. Then again, I think "wasting" anything, or being otherwise destructive, for no reason is a bad thing.

Originally Posted by Taunton

The ratified clubs list for 2009-2010 is here:

https://www.msumcmaster.ca/content/d...ubs%20List.pdf

(I know it says "to be ratified", but we ratified it already)

oooh Speech Science and Language Society

McMaster NDP Club (MacNDP) renamed to McMaster Campus New Democrats

Because that name is soooo much sexier!!! Like its new president.

Rawr.

Speaking of rawr, I have never seen anyone wear fur on campus. Leather, yeah, but fur? Not the most popular item in the student clothing world.

Originally Posted by Taunton

We as a society use the entire cow for one reason or another (eat the meat/organs, bones go into supplements + gelatin, hide turns into leather, etc). Chinchillas and foxes (as far as I know) aren't being used for the meat, organs, teeth, etc. Killing an animal just for the fur (which is unnecessary since we have synthetic materials) is what some people see as wasteful and wrong.

I'm no PETA person by any means, I just think it's wasteful to kill an animal just for a single thing. If you're going to go into a business (such as the fur trade), at least use the rest of the animal for something!

Very few farmed Animals are killed "just" for a single thing, although some Animals are bred for specific purposes. Think about it, farmers aren't burying these fur animals after they're killed. The uses for a skinned Animal range from being turned into those aforementioned byproducts to being used in low grade dog food to being composted into rich fertilizer. The Canadian Seal Hunt doesn't just use the fur but also the meat, bones used in Native art, as well as animal byproducts (seal oil, etc). I have a leather sporran (the bag a guy wears in front of his crotch with a kilt) and it's fairly nice. However, the real seal fur sporrans are beautiful. The quality and durability of the real ones far supasses any synthetic alternatives. Even if the seal died only to provide me with a nice sporran, so what? I don't consider that wasteful. It's my culture and I'd appreicate it if you'd get off your high horse (horses are breed for only 1 purpose, 2 if you count glue).

I could argue that using my tax dollars to subsidize Mac's visual arts program is wasteful. At least, as a tax payer, this issue impacts me. The fur trade, on the other hand, doesn't really impact most of the people who oppose it. Well that's not true, the Canadians who oppose it enjoy the benefits of the Government taxing the fur trade to pay for other things. I'd love to see a PETA supporter voluntarily offer to have their income tax increased to offset the lost government revenue should the fur trade be banned.

Alex McColl
Hons B.Comm 08

wtf who the crap says cows are ugly! poo on them. Lovely creatures!

TBrown <3's her cows.

I don't even get why people like wearing a lot of animal products. Even though they're dead; they're still a lot of work. My parents used to have some random fur coat in the closet that they got as a present from one of my weird uncles, and after a few years of hanging there, it leaked oil all over the place... friggin gross. Leather products you also need to moisturize, which is annoying if you don't because they get all stiff and crack. Plus; if you leave a lot of fur or leather products outside in rain or something, they get destroyed.

Synthetic and plant based clothing ftw :p

Something a little off-topic, but along animal welfare lines:

What do you think about in-vitro meat? It would be healthier for you, and better for animals and the environment. Scientists working for the research group New Harvest are making bold steps towards growing animal proteins in the laboratory.

From CNN.com: http://www.cnn.com/2009/TECH/science...eat/index.html

Originally Posted by Taunton

What do you think about in-vitro meat?

Have you ever met a female Tleilaxu?

Originally Posted by Alex McColl

Have you ever met a female Tleilaxu?

Sorry, I'm not a Dune fan.

Yea I decided I will wear it loud and proud! you definately won't miss it if you see it.. it's gorgeous.

This reminds me when in highschool I had some weirdo kids stick pictures of baby bunnies, seals and chinchillas on my locker....because I did a project on mink & rabbit crossbreeding in grade 9, which was actually geared towards the stupid animals.

by the way whenever someone bugs me about it i just say.... jesus wore fur.

Originally Posted by Alex McColl

I'd like to Ditto Joey on the 'oh my Elvis, the last thing Mac needs is PETA... Wow this girl is AWESOME!'

Wear it loud and proud. If anyone gives you a hard time ask them what they think of the Engineering and Athletic jackets, they're all made of Cow Leather. Then you can ask them about their iPod & Laptop. All modern electronics contain Mylar - made from Animal by-products. Almost every non brass instrument contains some animal products (glues, etc). Then you can ask them about the chair they sit on and the concrete they walk on and the soap they use... (I could go on like this, all of the aforementioned things are made with Animal byproducts).

Why is there a double standard where wearing fur is so much more evil than leather? Maybe it's because the cow was already dead since we eat beef, and cows aren't cute.

Originally Posted by Taunton

What do you think about in-vitro meat?

1) I don't think we know for certain whether or not it will be healthier. It definitely will not be 'good for you.'

A) "Ideal" Fatty Acid content varies from person to person, and across gender. They can't really go so far as to make the claim that they're going to make burgers that are 'good for you' because it's just not true. Everything is good in moderation, and everything in large doses is a bad thing.

B) I'm not trying to start a conspiracy theory here or anything, but we can't be completely certain of what is being put into the burgers. It'll most likely be something like a 'fluoridated water' situation, where we are allegedly receiving a treatment we can't refuse...or worse?

C) The article seems kind of dense, since the disorders listed (swine flu for instance) have nothing to do with the ingestion of meat. *shrug*

That being said, maybe they'll have less fat...but then, so does lean meat. Zero fat? So does protein supplementation (which isn't as healthy and serves a specific purpose).

2) I'm not really seeing how it's better for animals either. Did you mean that fewer animals will be slaughtered? But cows are domesticated right? If we released all the cows into the wild they'd all die since they depend on humans for food and such. It's kind of a tough call there, about which is worse.

3) And the environment? Cow farts?