Originally Posted by healthsci1

all health sci students do the same mcats as everyone else for medical school. If they have a low score they wont get in, regardless of the high GPA.

not to mention autosketch (extracurriculars, etc.), and interviews

and about health sci students getting high marks, then here's my opinion.
Well, health sci courses are differently structured. Materials are "taught" very differently or more like "self-directed". It focuses more on personal achievements than on relative comparison to others. They are, by no means, easy. Trust me. I would rather take normal biology than cell biology. You think there's no work involved? There are so many group meetings that eat up your life. Do you think group work is easy? Hell no. The expectation is obviously way higher in group projects, let alone group dynamics.
Also, many health scis do tend to do better than others in traditional life sci or any other courses. Most health scis Ive met (including upper years) agree that health sci courses can actually bring down their gpa.

I just don't think you can compare health sci courses with others. For example, some may say they are really easy, just like anyone could say about any other courses. Some may find chem REALLY REALLY easy while many others may not. In the similar fashion, some may find health sci courses REALLY REALLY easy while many others struggle.

I disagree with lifesci being easier. Most of us in healthsci are doing great & getting 12s in our non healthsci courses like chem, calc, etc but when it comes to healthsci courses like cellbio the majority are getting 9 and 10. I think if I were in lifesci, I would def get higher marks. Nonetheless, I would never change my program just to get better grades because I love the healthsci community and our courses. I've learnt so much in cell bio above the basic science knowledge that we can all really learn just by reading the textbook. I think what makes healthsci courses difficult is that alot of it involves self-directed learning and understanding that there isn't one right answer for everything.

Originally Posted by Mahratta

First year science programs tend to be pretty straight-forward - it's mainly review, and they still baby you a bit.

Life science seems to be a pretty boring stream to stay in - probably because bio / biochem is awfully drab for me - but I'm sure it gets tougher and more interesting next year.

By the way, I was in your physics lab group two weeks ago.

Lol, impressive that you caught that, though I suppose having my picture up on here helped somewhat.

And here come the Healthsci's to tell us that they have it just as hard lol, not this debate Again,. I think everyone already decided it is easier. lol easiest program in ontario? XD

Originally Posted by andrew22

And here come the Healthsci's to tell us that they have it just as hard lol, not this debate Again,. I think everyone already decided it is easier. lol easiest program in ontario? XD

This is purely immature. You haven't experienced the program yourself (here I am assuming so) and are telling people it's easy. As I mentioned before, the easiness can differ individually. Some people may find life science or any other courses extremely easy. For those, it may be a piece of cake whereas it could require a lot of effort for other people. The same thing goes for health sci. In addition health sci believes in students. In other words, what you learn is totally dependent on you in health sci. What you learn and get depends on you. You may learn a lot or not learn anything at all. I agree that some of health scis do slack off and brag about their "easy 12s". I do not deny that. Health sci, because of its nature, has a lot of group work, which could end up in similar marks for many people (even the ones who do not deserve these marks - but I shouldn't judge).
I am just saying that you can't only look at those people. There are truly people who are not only brilliant but also very hard working.
If health sci students just get marks for free and get into med schools really easy, then how would they be able to survive in those intense environments? I haven't heard of any stories where health sci students are performing worse than those coming from other programs.
Many people in health sci would have done well no matter where they had gone.

Actually, I've heard quite a few stories of hth scis being killed in med, esspecially at Toronto. I've also heard Toronto doesn't care much for hth sci students, the main argument that they have trouble adjusting to a more traditonal style and moving away from the safety parachute group work affords (it is very hard to fail if you have five people helping you basically), that they do not have the right knowledge base and that they have some issues with the Hth sci GPAs and how they tend to be quite high.

Of course, things are different all over - I'm sure Mac is easier for them, but still, there are some disadvantages. Esspecially considering Toronto has the best acceptance stats (something like 10%, if I remember, compared to Mac's 3 or 4%).

Of course, I'm not on the Tor committee, but I can't see this been entirely untrue and I must say I agree with the GPA inflation thing some people have already mentioned. I'm sorry Hth scis, but I do believe your marks are inflated. I'm not bashing you, I promise - this is just my honest opinion. Why do I think so? 1) PBL. As I mentioned, it is very hard to fail a group project. 2) The fact that there is a heavy indiviudal component to some courses - from what you've said, it seems less about reaching a real standard or some sort of cutoff and more about the person. Fine, nice, but it doesn't really mean anything on the outside. 3) The whole argument about "only people with good marks got in/everyone is brilliant" is absolutely bogus. You know as well as I do that HS is nothing and means nothing. Almost any other 2nd year program should be filled with brilliant people, once all the not serious ones have left. 4) You guys are the baby of Mac. It makes sense for them to want you to all have nice GPAs and show it off. (That's all I'm going to say about that one, read what you will).

Again, not trying to bash or be mean, but I wanted to chime in.

I read the first sentence of that and freaked out. I was like "OMGWTF they died!?" ...and then I felt stupid

Still feeling stupid, I have a question; what does this mean/what is it referring to?

"Esspecially considering Toronto has the best acceptance stats (something like 10%, if I remember, compared to Mac's 3 or 4%)."

Makes me glad to hear that some institutions are recognizing the health sci. facade, hopefully more end up doing the same.

Originally Posted by crazyfree

I read the first sentence of that and freaked out. I was like "OMGWTF they died!?" ...and then I felt stupid

Still feeling stupid, I have a question; what does this mean/what is it referring to?

"Esspecially considering Toronto has the best acceptance stats (something like 10%, if I remember, compared to Mac's 3 or 4%)."

He means that roughly 10% of those that applied to U of Toronto's medical school were accepted, while only 3-4% of those who applied to McMaster's medical school were accepted.

Originally Posted by Souldier

He means that roughly 10% of those that applied to U of Toronto's medical school were accepted, while only 3-4% of those who applied to McMaster's medical school were accepted.

If I'm understanding correctly...then it's a fairly irrelevant statistic considering that Mac has a much higher number of applicants. Of course a lower percentage get accepted 0_o

I'm lolling at all you health scis and life scis bashing each other.

Engineering > all of you.

Originally Posted by Pinakin

Hi, what does the program of health in macmaster look for in a student? Academic wise and extra-cirricular wise? are there any other related in other universities that are similar to health science?

thanks for the help

Hi Pinakin,

1) Academically, all you need is to meet the cutoff (this year it was 90%). Beyond that, your grades are irrelevant; admission is based entirely off of your supplementary application.

2) Health Sci doesn't look for anything extra-curricular wise. You can choose to mention extra-curriculars in your application if you like, but they won't necessarily increase your chances at admission.

3) There may be programs at other universities similar to Health Sci, but unfortunately I don't know specifically which programs those might be. The last time I researched my undergraduate options was almost four years ago, so I'm afraid that the only info I remember is well out of date!

Let me know if you have any further questions about the program. Keep in mind that there are alot of misconceptions about it floating around, both positive and negative, so don't hesitate to ask. Hope this helps!

Originally Posted by emtee10

3) There may be programs at other universities similar to Health Sci, but unfortunately I don't know specifically which programs those might be. The last time I researched my undergraduate options was almost four years ago, so I'm afraid that the only info I remember is well out of date!

My housemates in health sci tell me that "health sci" is still a unique thing to McMaster. That's why McMaster is so intent on showing the world how awesome health sci is I guess.

if you think mcmaster health sci is a joke, you should take a look at westerns health sci, its ridiculously easy.

I don't understand why this bashing is going on. I'm in Life Sci and I have a ton of friends in Health Sci. And they're really VERY different programs. You can't say your opinion of the program or compare Life Sci and Health Sci, unless you spent the 4 years in each of them, which I think none of us have. So it's not quite fair to judge in that case. After that.. then we can talk about GPA inflation and such.