oh and talking of how fundraising fails...well...if they can't get people interested, maybe they shouldn't force students to pay anyway, maybe people just don't care about the <insert club name here>

Yeah, hearing people writing off fundraising is a little disconcerting. If students won't support you via a fundraiser, that might be an indication of relevance.

I know SOCS isn't the best example as it is a Society and not a club, but our bake sale this year raised $100+ in a single day.

Originally Posted by A.Marlowe

Yeah, hearing people writing off fund raising is a little disconcerting. If students won't support you via a fundraiser, that might be an indication of relevance.

I know SOCS isn't the best example as it is a Society and not a club, but our bake sale this year raised $100+ in a single day.

I agree, but the key word there is "might". There are far too many other factors involved when it comes to bake sales or other fundraisers. The problem with fundraisers is you can make $100 in a day, or you can make $8. There are so many special interest groups on campus selling things and fund raising, it becomes hard to tell which ones should be getting more support. Like if you are fund raising so you can blow money on ordering way too many pizzas because you have misjudged attendance to your event(for example, 99% of groups who order pizza), maybe you shouldn't be getting that support. I know I have left multiple events this year being handed a box or two of pizza because too much pizza was ordered. So I end up walking away with half a day's work from a fundraiser because money was wasted. That being said I usually walk over to the lounge and feed the hardworking engineers, after which I am loved, so I benefit from the mistake. But others don't. You may wonder where the point of this example is? Point= ---> 35cents added to student fees goes directly to sending JF's overseas who will come back and benefit McMaster. We've already covered how, and where the money is going/being spent is very transparent.

The "it is only 35 cents" argument is a bit lame because added cost is added cost, the difference here is the cost-benefit analysis (drink it up econ kids) shows you that you gain more from supporting the overseas volunteer with your 35 cents.

Frankly, if it was supported by the entire school through the student fees, you will probably see more benefit in the future from sending the JF's over as well. I want to go abroad as a JF later on, and I know if every student is supporting me, I would be doubly busting my balls when I am there and when I get back to make sure the students are benefiting form my experiences as much as possible. I cant speak for others, but I know I would personally feel more of a push to produce.


Personally, I would like to see a wall in the MUSC with pictures of the people who go overseas; collect them over the years. But my wild musings wouldnt be part of those 35 cents.


Of course this is just my opinion after slaving away over a Materials assignment I missed the classes for, and after a long day of suck. I know I will be voting to have the 35 cents added. At least it is kinda nice that there will be one student fee that I was asked if I wanted to pay, and I got to have some sense of having a say in it.

Originally Posted by A.Marlowe

Yeah, hearing people writing off fundraising is a little disconcerting. If students won't support you via a fundraiser, that might be an indication of relevance.

I know SOCS isn't the best example as it is a Society and not a club, but our bake sale this year raised $100+ in a single day.

but you know most of that money came from SOCS people themselves. People are always more generous to their friends, especially when its a thing as rare as a SOCS bakesale.

the point is, the opportunity is there, so why not take advantage of it? they followed the rules and regulations and will most likely get their fee. we can argue about it till the cows come home but the system won't change.

you will have a lifetime of fees to pay for an innumerable amount of things. having a conniption for every one will leave you one very unhappy camper. might as well appreciate some of them.

I would gladly pay 35 cents for EWB. Its for a good cause

I wish we didn't have to pay any money in our fees to fund clubs. If you want to be part of a club then fundraise and get the money yourself.

Every time I go to Clubsfest all I see is tables filled with Religious and/or Cultural clubs. Why should I have to pay to fund these clubs? These clubs aren't inclusive (regardless of whether or not they technically are) and I disagree with them, why should I help fund them? If you want to hang around with other people of the same culture or religion do so on your own dime, or money from people who actually support your existence.

If an organization really means that much to someone and they support it they will support it as long as they can afford it. If students can't afford it that's crappy but why force the money out of them another way.

Keep more money in student pockets, special interests can find their own funding.*



*Keep in mind I'm not saying all organizations are bad or that the EWB is not a worthy cause. There are plently of organizations I would support personally but I don't think everyone should be forced to.

Originally Posted by sew12

I wish we didn't have to pay any money in our fees to fund clubs. If you want to be part of a club then fundraise and get the money yourself.

Every time I go to Clubsfest all I see is tables filled with Religious and/or Cultural clubs. Why should I have to pay to fund these clubs? These clubs aren't inclusive (regardless of whether or not they technically are) and I disagree with them, why should I help fund them? If you want to hang around with other people of the same culture or religion do so on your own dime, or money from people who actually support your existence.

If an organization really means that much to someone and they support it they will support it as long as they can afford it. If students can't afford it that's crappy but why force the money out of them another way.

Keep more money in student pockets, special interests can find their own funding.*



*Keep in mind I'm not saying all organizations are bad or that the EWB is not a worthy cause. There are plently of organizations I would support personally but I don't think everyone should be forced to.

its called adding culture and diversity to people's university experience. without some kind of funding all of these clubs will be spending all their time begging you for money rather than doing what they do...meaning they would not last long.

if you think this is bad, you should see some of the things our government spends your tax dollars on.

so yes, in a perfect world, all of the clubs on campus would generate enough interest to be able to charge membership fees and have a dedicated fundraising team turning the student center into a permenant and wildly successful bake sale, leaving you with a couple extra bucks in your pocket.

but in reality, the number of clubs would likely dwindle down to the few that can garner outside funding. funding that might come from some evil corporation with an agenda to brainwash us into doing unspeakably evil things such as joining the seal hunt or buying coke products.

BUT YOU'D LIKE THAT WOULDN'T YOU?!?!

Originally Posted by waddlesworth

its called adding culture and diversity to people's university experience. without some kind of funding all of these clubs will be spending all their time begging you for money rather than doing what they do...meaning they would not last long.

The way I see its doing the exact opposite of that. Again, most of the clubs you see around Campus are Religions and/or Cultural clubs that attact only people that fit into that group. How is creating a club so you can hang out with all people that are the same as you (ie Chinese Christian) adding diversity to your University experience? If anything its removing diversity from your life/university experience.

In a perfect would majority of our clubs wouldn't be clubs devoted to a Religion and/or Culture.

Originally Posted by sew12

The way I see its doing the exact opposite of that. Again, most of the clubs you see around Campus are Religions and/or Cultural clubs that attact only people that fit into that group. How is creating a club so you can hang out with all people that are the same as you (ie Chinese Christian) adding diversity to your University experience? If anything its removing diversity from your life/university experience.

In a perfect would majority of our clubs wouldn't be clubs devoted to a Religion and/or Culture.

you misunderstood me. the culture and diversity was not referring to cultural clubs per se, but more as a deviation from the monotony of school work. and of course that was referring to the fact that without funding many clubs would not exist, thereby reducing the potential of students to get more from their university careers than studying and assignments.

you really seem to have a problem with the religious loonies! but that's really besides your point. they're allowed to have a club, they can meet other people with similar interests, make friends and have a good time. i'd say thats definitely adding to one's university experience. saying that Chinese Christians are all the same is interesting (and rather controversial).

by having funding for clubs, you open up the possibility for much more diversity. have you been to clubsfest? there are many clubs on campus. just because they don't set up tables in the student center doesn't mean they're not there.

Originally Posted by Rossclot

Of course this is just my opinion after slaving away over a Materials assignment I missed the classes for, and after a long day of suck. I know I will be voting to have the 35 cents added. At least it is kinda nice that there will be one student fee that I was asked if I wanted to pay, and I got to have some sense of having a say in it.

If you were around last year you had a say in the bus pass fees too. The only reason why I'm iffy on this as of now is that I've seen this happen at other schools, where one group gets money through a referendum, then MANY groups try coming in to get the same thing and it either creates an inequity or increasing fees. To prevent this, I forget which school, but I think one of them had a referendum for $3, and had multiple groups who had submitted interest in receiving some of that money. They then put out a ballot with all of those clubs/groups on it, and the ones with the most votes got the money. In some ways I prefer that type of a system because then it's not just one option.

I have nothing against EWB, I think they do fantastic work. I just know there are hundreds of groups on campus that do fantastic work, that would benefit from thousands of dollars. I don't really agree with instituting a fee that lasts more than one year for one specific group when there are so many others deserving of something like this.

Originally Posted by adrian

Anyway, I think that I agree with you in the fact that most clubs don't need this. So the fact that very few clubs would go for this "special money" pretty simple. The current system would benefit from this simplicity.

I think that if only three or four clubs would be applying every year... why not just give them the money? It saves everyone the headache...

Also, clubs fundraise a lot, if you've been to the student centre recently. I see bake sales ALLLLLL the time. Saying that students shouldn't fund clubs is equivalent to the government cutting funding to arts programs in public schools in my opinion... they're not "necessary," but they add a lot to one's experience.

The point that if an organization means THAT MUCH to someone that they would keep it afloat until they could no longer pay for it? That's ridiculous. The people in these clubs are students like everyone else. It's not like they're all super rich and can afford everything. Clubs are meant to be fun and something to work on in between school... it shouldn't be a drain on someone's life. I've had a club be a drain on my life AND my wallet. It was miserable and I was out of there as soon as I could.

I would also hope that this referendum doesn't cause a huge influx of x club suddenly wanting money... though I would hope that any group that jumps on the bandwagon at least has a legitimate use for the money, like EWB does. Not just "we want more pizza."

Originally Posted by waddlesworth

you misunderstood me. the culture and diversity was not referring to cultural clubs per se, but more as a deviation from the monotony of school work. and of course that was referring to the fact that without funding many clubs would not exist, thereby reducing the potential of students to get more from their university careers than studying and assignments.

you really seem to have a problem with the religious loonies! but that's really besides your point. they're allowed to have a club, they can meet other people with similar interests, make friends and have a good time. i'd say thats definitely adding to one's university experience. saying that Chinese Christians are all the same is interesting (and rather controversial).

by having funding for clubs, you open up the possibility for much more diversity. have you been to clubsfest? there are many clubs on campus. just because they don't set up tables in the student center doesn't mean they're not there.

I do have a problem with the "relgious loonies" as you put it but that's a seperate issue. I doubt most of the religous people on campus are loonies. I also don't only have a problem with the religious clubs, note I also mentioned the cultural clubs. People don't choose to be Chinese or Polish but there are Chinese and Polish clubs on campus for people to only hang out with others of the same culture. I also disagree with those clubs, not just the ones that are religious in nature.

As for Chinese Christians I didn't say all Chinese Christians are the same I mentioned that as an example b/c I happen to know there is a club on campus for Chinese Christians, or at least there was at the last Clubsfest I went to. It wasn't meant to be interesting or convtroversial, it was just an example of a club. I don't think all Chinese Christian people are the same, for the record.

I don't disagree with funding for clubs in general, just funding for clubs that are based on Religion and/or Culture. Clubs based around hobbies that are inclusive and do add to people's University experience are fine by me. I just disagree with the idea of having clubs based on a Religion or Culture.

Originally Posted by Iman

The point that if an organization means THAT MUCH to someone that they would keep it afloat until they could no longer pay for it? That's ridiculous. The people in these clubs are students like everyone else. It's not like they're all super rich and can afford everything. Clubs are meant to be fun and something to work on in between school... it shouldn't be a drain on someone's life. I've had a club be a drain on my life AND my wallet. It was miserable and I was out of there as soon as I could.

I would also hope that this referendum doesn't cause a huge influx of x club suddenly wanting money... though I would hope that any group that jumps on the bandwagon at least has a legitimate use for the money, like EWB does. Not just "we want more pizza."

To the bolded part, umm exactly? If you don't want people to have to fund their own clubs b/c they're students like everyone else why do you make to force all students to have to fund the club?

You can hope all you want but if this referendum works then other clubs will want money as well, and why shouldn't they? If EWB can get money why shouldn't other clubs be able to ask for money too?

Every time I go to Clubsfest all I see is tables filled with Religious and/or Cultural clubs

I've stayed away from religious/cultural clubs as well, but Clubsfest tends to group the same types of groups together. So if you're seeing a whole chunk of religious groups, you're probably in the wrong area. Most of the social justice groups are grouped together, then Academic groups, etc.

Originally Posted by Jay

I've stayed away from religious/cultural clubs as well, but Clubsfest tends to group the same types of groups together. So if you're seeing a whole chunk of religious groups, you're probably in the wrong area. Most of the social justice groups are grouped together, then Academic groups, etc.


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I go through all the tables when I go to Clubsfest, I know we have other types of Clubs, I just notice there is an abundance of Religious/Cultural clubs.