They only did this so kids how no excuse to be "left out" in frosh

Originally Posted by Leeoku

They only did this so kids how no excuse to be "left out" in frosh

thats an awful reason to make it mandatory. and i doubt that's the reason >_>

Originally Posted by Silver

thats an awful reason to make it mandatory. and i doubt that's the reason >_>

I thought the idea is that since everyone pays for it, you might as well show up (for those that were on the fence) since it doesn't cost any more. It was supposed to boost attendance to help people feel more welcome.

Allllllright....

There were a few reasons why the fee was changed.

1. The funding model which we had used was expiring. The true cost of Welcome Week was about $150 per student, but that cost was subsidized by the Student Services Committee so it was set at $135.00

2. The other real option was to blow up Welcome Week. I mean all the 'fun events' consist of the concert, Mac-Connector, the concerts etc are funded by the MSU and from Faculty Societies. There was an opportunity to basically put the MSU with the Faculty Societies and develop their own fee which would have essentially competed with the Residence Life Welcome Week. Although this seemed interesting, students would have had to suffer while Welcome Week sorted itself out.

3. Having spoken to a number of Welcome Week planners and reps an issue that was flagged was that there was a lot of confusion regarding purchasing the Mac Pass, what to do when they ran out, and that ultimately students lost out because when there were none they couldn't really participate. The hope was that with this change there would be greater participation, and it would be far more inclusive.

With all of this said, there needs to be an opt out. Plain and simple.

Originally Posted by Alomar12

There is a major difference between HSR and WW fees. HSR fees are the result of a contract with an outside organization. WW fees are not. As you say they are used to arrange welcome week events and "to allow everyone access". How much of the money actually is spent on Welcome Week? That is a number I would like to see, but they will never make it public, presumably because the students would be appalled at the figure.

It all goes back to which portion of the student body is being punished. Previously, a limited number of MacPasses were available. McMaster did a poor job of communicating information about them to the students and some people missed out on events. They sold out of passes quite regularly, so the excuse that they didn't know how much money they had really doesn't fly. McMaster heard the students' complaints about missing out and saw it as a great opportunity. Rather than communicate more effectively (in acceptance/orientation packages, on the website, etc.), they decided to take the onus off the students to seek the information by automatically charging them for it with no chance to opt out. They have no regard for the fact that some students choose not to attend welcome week, while some simply are unable to for whatever reason. Why should some students be punished for what they are not using instead of lazy students who fail to take appropriate action (i.e. buy a MacPass)? We are able to opt out of the health and dental insurance (which is also, conveniently, poorly advertised - SEP 30 deadline!) which, like the bus pass could possibly have some benefit.

I find this quite maddening that students can opt out of insurance, but not out of what is essentially an amusement tax funding events that they may not even participate in. I understand it is in the contract for McMaster, but the legality of it certainly seems to be open to challenge.

The only reason students are allowed to opt out of insurance is because they are already covered under another insurance plan and therefore do not need the coverage.

You can't argue that some students are being "punished" because they are required to pay the mandatory fee even though they cannot or choose not to attend. The majority of the student body voted for the mandatory fee. We live in a country where we are taxed in order to have certain programs which not all the citizens may end up using or even be qualified for.

Originally Posted by Snowman

I thought the idea is that since everyone pays for it, you might as well show up (for those that were on the fence) since it doesn't cost any more. It was supposed to boost attendance to help people feel more welcome.

yea, of course you would feel more inclined to go if youre forced to pay, but idk about boosting attendance since the money is gonna be received anyways. the reasons for it were listed anyways.

Originally Posted by Silver

yea, of course you would feel more inclined to go if youre forced to pay, but idk about boosting attendance since the money is gonna be received anyways. the reasons for it were listed anyways.

I didn't say I agree with it at all, but many people would not have paid so I can see why they wanted to push it through, as well as the other points listed above.

i didnt say u agreed with anything. whyd u mention dat

Originally Posted by jhan523

The only reason students are allowed to opt out of insurance is because they are already covered under another insurance plan and therefore do not need the coverage.

You can't argue that some students are being "punished" because they are required to pay the mandatory fee even though they cannot or choose not to attend. The majority of the student body voted for the mandatory fee. We live in a country where we are taxed in order to have certain programs which not all the citizens may end up using or even be qualified for.

The majority of the student body had no vote on the mandatory fee. Most importantly neither did the potential payers of the fee. To the voting students the outcome was irrelevant because they would not be the ones charged.

This is entirely incomparable to health insurance because health insurance is an essential service. No one suffers greatly if the are unable to attend welcome week.

Originally Posted by Alomar12

The majority of the student body had no vote on the mandatory fee. Most importantly neither did the potential payers of the fee. To the voting students the outcome was irrelevant because they would not be the ones charged.

This is entirely incomparable to health insurance because health insurance is an essential service. No one suffers greatly if the are unable to attend welcome week.

Incoming students can't vote on any fees because they have to be decided before the entire class is officially even coming to mac.

P.S. The majority of the student body had an opportunity to show up to GA and vote on the fee. If people don't like the GA mechanism they should put forward a motion to the next GA to remove GAs from the Constitution of the MSU.