Originally Posted by Scarecrow

LikeX10000!!

harper is an egomaniac, simple as that.
the HARPER goverment!?!?!?!?
he needs to be out of office like yesterday.

Originally Posted by chrisjones

harper is an egomaniac, simple as that.
the HARPER goverment!?!?!?!?
he needs to be out of office like yesterday.

Well, Ignatieff was APPOINTED party leader. There wasn't even a vote in his own party. This just screams democracy.

baha, there was never a comment of how Harper made it into the leadership role for the Conservatives. . . Additionally, there has been very little issue with Ignatieff's leadership of the Liberals. He replaced Stephan Dion, who NO ONE wanted.

Originally Posted by chrisjones

harper is an egomaniac, simple as that.
the HARPER goverment!?!?!?!?
he needs to be out of office like yesterday.

I don't see the issue with a government being named after its leader. From an accountability perspective this seems like a good idea. Whether you support the government's actions or not, you know exactly who to direct your feelings towards and who to hold accountable if you are not pleased.

But what is it exactly that Harper has done to make your lives so difficult? (Note: this question is not directed at the person I'm quoting, just a general question to all haters of the Conservative party)

Originally Posted by mike_302

baha, there was never a comment of how Harper made it into the leadership role for the Conservatives. . . Additionally, there has been very little issue with Ignatieff's leadership of the Liberals. He replaced Stephan Dion, who NO ONE wanted.

Seeing as I voted for him when the new conservative party formed, I can say that "yes he was elected" by members of the conservative party of Canada. And, yes, if ignatieff loses this election, I can see him stepping down as leader.

Originally Posted by Giygas

I don't see the issue with a government being named after its leader. From an accountability perspective this seems like a good idea. Whether you support the government's actions or not, you know exactly who to direct your feelings towards and who to hold accountable if you are not pleased.

But what is it exactly that Harper has done to make your lives so difficult? (Note: this question is not directed at the person I'm quoting, just a general question to all haters of the Conservative party)

Is it really a priority to rename and relabel everything that IS the Canadian government? This means:
- Our money is going to transition a general "The Canadian Government" label that works timelessly (with the exception of minor updates)
- The transition will have to occur every time the government changes power
- The transition, so close to an election, is excessively egotistical

I think people see this as a very simple feature of the government, and such a small item that it hardly effects anyone. But for the sake of back-of-the-envelope estimating:
- Every pre-made envelope
- Every pre-made paper with a letterhead
- Every stamp
- Every government electronic document that attached the logo to e-mails automatically

^^^^ The above are going to involve at least a couple of hours of work, and most certainly thousands of office items, and hundreds of thousands of dollars...

Then there's the actual logo design. You know there's a company being paid to redesign a 2"x3" logo for this, and as small as it is, we also know he's not paying some mom-and-pop designer for 10 hours and several design option... This went to some big corporation.

I sound picky, but I made a point to break it all down. Once more, I won't claim the Liberals or any other government hasn't made some tiny transition like this, that cost taxpayers ridiculous amounts of money (someone wants to bring up sponsorship scandal again... I know it. For that person: Go back in the thread, because it was already discussed) but the point was made that we're funding a massive boost for Stephen Harper's ego, and it's one more reason why I don't see him deserving a promotion. And it's another reason why I don't understand how he will have deficits paid off even earlier than expected.

Originally Posted by Giygas

I don't see the issue with a government being named after its leader. From an accountability perspective this seems like a good idea. Whether you support the government's actions or not, you know exactly who to direct your feelings towards and who to hold accountable if you are not pleased.

But what is it exactly that Harper has done to make your lives so difficult? (Note: this question is not directed at the person I'm quoting, just a general question to all haters of the Conservative party)

I don't like the sound of the Harper Government simply because it's not his government alone, it's the government of the Canadian people, hence why it should be called the Canadian Government.

And why does the name of the government need to change? The name is perfectly fine as it stands, and again, represents the people that the government is supposed to represent, so why change something that's working? Why not use the energy and money that this name transition is using towards something more useful?

The problem with him calling it "harper government' is that it implies it is his, the pm doesnt own the country. Harper is our temporary representative, and he doesnt finalize every descision (especially in a minority gov), by changing the name it implies he has more power than he does(remember all the policies he puts forward must be voted on). Its a mad ego trip IMO.

Vote Liberal then?

the damn first past the post system will turn us into the united states, we will have 2 parties, neither who does what the people want.

Now I'm ready to put the Conservatives above the Liberals in sleeziness. What the hell is this!?

Exhibit A: http://edmonton.ctv.ca/servlet/an/lo...b=EdmontonHome

Seems like the Conservatives went against Parliament again, and lied in order to obtain $50 million in funding for the G8 summit in Huntsville. And we're not talking little white lies here... We're talking about who they put in charge, and what they told them they'd spend the money on. Sure, all governments do this to an extent, but given two option: Harper vs. Ignatieff I'm going to give the one a chance that doesn't have this on him.

FYI: It's Rick Mercer that pointed this one out to everyone, and he also made note that the Harper government shut down Parliament with their outlandish budget just DAYS before the report was released which was going to nail the government for this illegal activity. (Once again, you can bring up the Sponsorship scandal, but at this point, the Conservatives have their own Sponsorship scandal going on. The difference is that they've gone above the law to make sure voters don't hear about it until after they're put back into power, and the Liberals have restructured)

Then there's Exhibit B, which NOT all governments do... Just the ones that are above and transcendent of democracy.

Exhibit B: http://www.winnipegfreepress .com/s...119563529.html

Our Harper government has ensured that, win or lose, they're walking away with more of your money! HA! Joke's on Canadians, says "The Harper Government". They snuck this little bit of documentation through that says the Conservatives will get a pay raise if they get re-elected, and if not, they get up to a 9-month severance pay package. They had severance pay before, but that wasn't enough for them.

Let me add this up: Conservative politicians get a raise, Hidden costs of the fighter jet program, and our taxes get lowered... And Harper expects to pay off the deficit SOONER than expected? You were dropped on the head at a young age if you believe that important things like health care and tuition costs aren't going to hit you harder given a Conservative government. Let's not even talk about "the deficit".

I could go on about Harper's inability to explain the cost over runs by several billion on his "fighter plane" deal with the U.S., because I've been following that one closely, and Harper has no ground to stand on anymore, but I'll leave that one for another time.

Originally Posted by mike_302

Now I'm ready to put the Conservatives above the Liberals in sleeziness. What the hell is this!?

Exhibit A: http://edmonton.ctv.ca/servlet/an/lo...b=EdmontonHome

Seems like the Conservatives went against Parliament again, and lied in order to obtain $50 million in funding for the G8 summit in Huntsville. And we're not talking little white lies here... We're talking about who they put in charge, and what they told them they'd spend the money on. Sure, all governments do this to an extent, but given two option: Harper vs. Ignatieff I'm going to give the one a chance that doesn't have this on him.

FYI: It's Rick Mercer that pointed this one out to everyone, and he also made note that the Harper government shut down Parliament with their outlandish budget just DAYS before the report was released which was going to nail the government for this illegal activity. (Once again, you can bring up the Sponsorship scandal, but at this point, the Conservatives have their own Sponsorship scandal going on. The difference is that they've gone above the law to make sure voters don't hear about it until after they're put back into power, and the Liberals have restructured)

Then there's Exhibit B, which NOT all governments do... Just the ones that are above and transcendent of democracy.

Exhibit B: http://www.winnipegfreepress .com/s...119563529.html

Our Harper government has ensured that, win or lose, they're walking away with more of your money! HA! Joke's on Canadians, says "The Harper Government". They snuck this little bit of documentation through that says the Conservatives will get a pay raise if they get re-elected, and if not, they get up to a 9-month severance pay package. They had severance pay before, but that wasn't enough for them.

Let me add this up: Conservative politicians get a raise, Hidden costs of the fighter jet program, and our taxes get lowered... And Harper expects to pay off the deficit SOONER than expected? You were dropped on the head at a young age if you believe that important things like health care and tuition costs aren't going to hit you harder given a Conservative government. Let's not even talk about "the deficit".

I could go on about Harper's inability to explain the cost over runs by several billion on his "fighter plane" deal with the U.S., because I've been following that one closely, and Harper has no ground to stand on anymore, but I'll leave that one for another time.

Now I'm not particularly impressed with any party, but can we stop beating the dead fighter plane horse and look at more issues? Its getting annoying. How much do you think fighter jets cost? $20 each?

I only looked into it more today because there was more evidence that it will cost more, and Harper's been defending the cost, saying "It won't cost more than I said", while the US is just discovering it'll cost twice the amount, they're unhappy, and it was pointed out that US laws restrict them from selling military equipment to other countries at lower costs than they pay for it... Harper says to Canadians "Nono, we have a deal with them it won't double the cost".

Ultimately, I'm going to make a prediction here: Harper continues to insist this "no extra cost" and it goes to court for years and becomes a massive cost anyways, to fight.

I'm also not against the cost so much as the government's lack of tendering in the project (they didn't look for better prices, and they say that was the right choice) and they are fighting to maintain a deal that is clearly going to end up in court for years...