I have a decision to make, which is between Waterloo, McMaster and MAYBE Ryerson.

I know that Waterloo has an excellent coop system and everyone can get a job fairly easy. But I also hear that Waterloo is VERY difficult and that you will be doing nothing but studying, there is no student life. Second, the university is rather far away from Mississauga, and even tho Mac is still far, I could easily visit home here.

1) Is the Computer Science program at Mac any good?
2) How is the coop system?
3) How much do you work each year if you are taking coop?
4) How does Mac compare to Waterloo in terms of the program?
5) Is it difficult to find/get a job?
6) Does Mac offer a system where jobs are posted (like jobmine I think in Waterloo)?
7) What is the English requirement for the program? My conditions only state a 80%+ average.

Other questions:
1) Is it worth taking a drive from Mississauga to Mac every day? (google says its like a 45 minute drive)
2) In terms of specs, what kind of laptop/netbook should I buy for Computer Science?
3) How difficult is first year at Mac?
4) What kind of electives are available?
5) Difficult to get an off campus apartment?
6) Can I still be involved in student life if I live off campus?


Sorry for so many questions, you don't have to answer all, just any piece of information will help. Thank you.

Originally Posted by RomanT

I have a decision to make, which is between Waterloo, McMaster and MAYBE Ryerson.

I know that Waterloo has an excellent coop system and everyone can get a job fairly easy. But I also hear that Waterloo is VERY difficult and that you will be doing nothing but studying, there is no student life. Second, the university is rather far away from Mississauga, and even tho Mac is still far, I could easily visit home here.

1) Is the Computer Science program at Mac any good?
2) How is the coop system?
3) How much do you work each year if you are taking coop?
4) How does Mac compare to Waterloo in terms of the program?
5) Is it difficult to find/get a job?
6) Does Mac offer a system where jobs are posted (like jobmine I think in Waterloo)?
7) What is the English requirement for the program? My conditions only state a 80%+ average.

Other questions:
1) Is it worth taking a drive from Mississauga to Mac every day? (google says its like a 45 minute drive)
2) In terms of specs, what kind of laptop/netbook should I buy for Computer Science?
3) How difficult is first year at Mac?
4) What kind of electives are available?
5) Difficult to get an off campus apartment?
6) Can I still be involved in student life if I live off campus?


Sorry for so many questions, you don't have to answer all, just any piece of information will help. Thank you.

I can't really answer your questions in terms of experience. But in terms of information:

Co-Op: http://www.eng.mcmaster.ca/ecs/index.html
Computer Science: http://www.cas.mcmaster.ca/cas/0template1.php?907
Computer Science: http://registrar.mcmaster.ca /calen...nt/pg1200.html

You'll have to start off in General Engineering I and apply to computer science. Acceptance depends on how well you do in first year.

Also, I'm sure someone from computer science will answer your questions but in terms of comparing you waterloo, you will have to get information from a waterloo computer science student.

Some answers:
Off-Campus housing isn't that hard to find: http://macoffcampus.mcmaster .ca/
You can definitively be apart of the community even if you live off-campus. You'll have to make an effort to join clubs and socialize. There is a club fair, I think twice a year.

Originally Posted by RomanT

I have a decision to make, which is between Waterloo, McMaster and MAYBE Ryerson.

I know that Waterloo has an excellent coop system and everyone can get a job fairly easy. But I also hear that Waterloo is VERY difficult and that you will be doing nothing but studying, there is no student life. Second, the university is rather far away from Mississauga, and even tho Mac is still far, I could easily visit home here.

1) Is the Computer Science program at Mac any good?
2) How is the coop system?
3) How much do you work each year if you are taking coop?
4) How does Mac compare to Waterloo in terms of the program?
5) Is it difficult to find/get a job?
6) Does Mac offer a system where jobs are posted (like jobmine I think in Waterloo)?
7) What is the English requirement for the program? My conditions only state a 80%+ average.

Other questions:
1) Is it worth taking a drive from Mississauga to Mac every day? (google says its like a 45 minute drive)
2) In terms of specs, what kind of laptop/netbook should I buy for Computer Science?
3) How difficult is first year at Mac?
4) What kind of electives are available?
5) Difficult to get an off campus apartment?
6) Can I still be involved in student life if I live off campus?


Sorry for so many questions, you don't have to answer all, just any piece of information will help. Thank you.

1) Of course the Computer Science program at Mac is good. If you didn't know, Mac Comp Sci students are regularly placed in top 20 in annual North American ACM Programming Contest.
2) Co-op system at Mac isn't great though. To be honest if you are looking for co-op, Waterloo is really good.
3) You have an option of going for a co-op term for four months after each academic year or a 12/16 month co-op term after 3rd year.
4) Waterloo is better IMO.
5) It depends completely on your caliber. You will have to find a job based on your performance and networking.
6) Yes, the system is called OSCAR.
7) There is no such mention on as to how much you require in each subject. 80%+ average is usually the important factor more than individual marks.

1) I wouldn't recommend it at all. It is a nightmare commuting from Mississauga as I have had friends who tried but failed.
2) Anything would do. Nothing hi-fi is required specifically for computer science.
3) Again, depends. A lot of students fail in first year Engineering. It really depends whether you are here to study or party. When I say study, I don't mean don't party, but there is a limit to everything.
4) http://www.eng.mcmaster.ca/documents/electives.pdf
5) Not at all IMO. But again, I know it costs a lot but I would recommend you staying on campus for first year to create a network.
6) You can, but not as much as by staying on campus.

I hope I have answered your questions.

feel free to ask more

Originally Posted by RomanT

1) Is the Computer Science program at Mac any good?
2) How is the coop system?
3) How much do you work each year if you are taking coop?
4) How does Mac compare to Waterloo in terms of the program?
5) Is it difficult to find/get a job?
6) Does Mac offer a system where jobs are posted (like jobmine I think in Waterloo)?
7) What is the English requirement for the program? My conditions only state a 80%+ average.

Other questions:
1) Is it worth taking a drive from Mississauga to Mac every day? (google says its like a 45 minute drive)
2) In terms of specs, what kind of laptop/netbook should I buy for Computer Science?
3) How difficult is first year at Mac?
4) What kind of electives are available?
5) Difficult to get an off campus apartment?
6) Can I still be involved in student life if I live off campus?

I'm going into third year compsci, so let me take a swing at some of these.

1) From what I've heard, Mac is pretty good for compsci. I've never really compared it with any other schools, but it's a good program. There are a couple bad profs, but overall, they're pretty good.
However, if you're going in expecting a lot of programming, you might be disappointed. At least in second year, theory is the main focus.
Also, a lot of the courses are shared with soft eng, although maybe it's like that everywhere.

2/3) Well, I haven't taken coop yet, although I'm planning to. To get the coop designation, you have to complete 12 months by the time you graduate. There's two ways to do that: take a year off to do coop, or do 4 months every summer. It might be difficult to find a position after first year, though. I'm personally going to take a year of coop after 3rd year.

4) Not really sure how it stacks up to Waterloo... I would suggest just taking a glance at each of the course calenders, see what the courses look like.

5/6) Not really sure, as I haven't looked for a job yet. There was some discussion about that in this thread: http://www.macinsiders.com/showthread.php?t=2720 1 And they post jobs on OSCAR that you can access once you pass the coop course.

7) Not really sure what you mean... there's not really a requirement for your English mark, if that's what you mean.

Other 2) Any kind of laptop should be fine. I would avoid netbooks. In my experience this last year, I was working almost every day in the library with some classmates, so it's good to have a decent size laptop to work on. Mac, linux or windows should all be fine. In fact, windows is probably the most hassle to program with (I use a macbook, in case you can't tell).

Other 3) First term is a breeze. The only (required) compsci course is 1MD3, which is basically high school level programming.
Second term is 1FC3, which is difficult if you've never seen discrete math before, which you probably haven't. When I took it, it covered logic, sets, relations, graphs, induction, recursion, counting and trees. I heard it changed a bit last year.
The engineering maths can be difficult, depending on how good you are at calculus and all that.

Other 4) Well, in first year, you have 15 units of electives. I'm pretty sure the engineering restrictions on electives don't apply to us (we're in engineering, but aren't engineers), so you can take anything you want, really. Check the course calender. Some people I know are working towards minors in econ, math or stats. I'm trying to get a Japanese studies minor, myself.
My only real suggestion for first year electives is to take compsci 2MF3 a year early. It's an introduction to architecture. It's a fairly simple course, and getting it early might help you prepare for the upper level architecture (especially because this last year, they messed up the order of the two; advanced architecture was the term before introductory architecture).



Just one other note... for me at least, first year programming was Java, second was OCaml and C. We also used a bit of perl in second year.

Originally Posted by RomanT

Other questions:
1) Is it worth taking a drive from Mississauga to Mac every day? (google says its like a 45 minute drive)
2) In terms of specs, what kind of laptop/netbook should I buy for Computer Science?
3) How difficult is first year at Mac?
4) What kind of electives are available?
5) Difficult to get an off campus apartment?
6) Can I still be involved in student life if I live off campus?


Sorry for so many questions, you don't have to answer all, just any piece of information will help. Thank you.

1) I would say probably not although I hear that quite a few Mississauga people actually do commute, but it depends on where you live in Mississauga. If you live more north/east and not close to the QEW, then obviously it'll take you longer to get here. Also, you need to consider that you might get stuck in traffic if you have classes/get off class during rush hour, so that 45 minutes might not be a good indication of how long it will take.

It is also expensive to park on campus, not to mention that the cheapest parking lot is a bit of a walk to most buildings. I would not really recommend it, but maybe other people have more positive advice .

5) Like everyone else is saying, not really. McMaster is surrounded largely by student housing. That site that Jeremy (jhan523) above is very helpful. There is also an off-campus housing office and a fair that runs sometime during the year (January I think?).

6) Definitely! Well, if you're commuting from Mississauga, you might be at a disadvantage, but you could still potentially be involved (I don't know enough to comment on this...). If you're just off-campus and in the area, school is normally just a quick walk or bus ride away.

Thank you for all your help, but I have a few more things I'd like to ask.
1) The computer science program is part of engineering first year, correct? What happens in second year? What degree do you get? Bachelor of science or engineering?
2) Lets say I do take coop for full year, would I be able to pay off any of the tuition fees? What worries me is that if I go to Mac I'll enjoy the program but if I take residence, I'll be in heavy debt at the end because the coop program might not work out for me. Waterloo just almost guarantees work and I would be able to pay off things easily, but then again I really don't want to go there lol.
3) The electives I saw on the pdf file don't interest me at all, maybe Greek? but everything seems really dull, would someone suggest something if I were to accept my offer?
4) Are there any chemistry/physics courses since it is part of engineering first year?
5) The reason I asked about the ENG requirement is because someone told me their friend had gotten an 82% average of top six courses but was rejected because their English mark was 70%. My conditional offer only states an above 80 in all top six courses. I can get an 80 because I had about 86 in physics, 90 or so in computer science, 90 or so in adv. functions, 87 right now in calculus, etc. but my English was around 66% because I admitted to teacher I plagiarized on my essay lol. Either way I did very well on quizes, etc. and she felt bad for me so she gave me a 70 on midterms. I do not know exact mark.

Also Waterloo allows for summer school make up course extensions, mac does not. Going to mac would be very risky because I am not able to take summer school make up course if I do bad in English.

Why is everything pointing for me to go to Waterloo?

Originally Posted by RomanT

Thank you for all your help, but I have a few more things I'd like to ask.
1) The computer science program is part of engineering first year, correct? What happens in second year? What degree do you get? Bachelor of science or engineering?
2) Lets say I do take coop for full year, would I be able to pay off any of the tuition fees? What worries me is that if I go to Mac I'll enjoy the program but if I take residence, I'll be in heavy debt at the end because the coop program might not work out for me. Waterloo just almost guarantees work and I would be able to pay off things easily, but then again I really don't want to go there lol.
3) The electives I saw on the pdf file don't interest me at all, maybe Greek? but everything seems really dull, would someone suggest something if I were to accept my offer?
4) Are there any chemistry/physics courses since it is part of engineering first year?
5) The reason I asked about the ENG requirement is because someone told me their friend had gotten an 82% average of top six courses but was rejected because their English mark was 70%. My conditional offer only states an above 80 in all top six courses. I can get an 80 because I had about 86 in physics, 90 or so in computer science, 90 or so in adv. functions, 87 right now in calculus, etc. but my English was around 66% because I admitted to teacher I plagiarized on my essay lol. Either way I did very well on quizes, etc. and she felt bad for me so she gave me a 70 on midterms. I do not know exact mark.

Also Waterloo allows for summer school make up course extensions, mac does not. Going to mac would be very risky because I am not able to take summer school make up course if I do bad in English.

Why is everything pointing for me to go to Waterloo?

1) Engineering I is general engineering. You have to apply to Computer Science, a level II program during level I (sometime in March I believe).
2) I'm not sure about how much co-op pays. There are many financial aid stuff at McMaster though, and don't forget OSAP which is an interest free loan until your graduate. There is also the McMaster bursary.
3) Only those electives will go towards your program. Any other electives taken will be for your own interest.
4)Here are the courses you need to take in engineering I http://registrar.mcmaster.ca /CALEN...nt/pg1197.html
5)I don't think you need to take English in engineering. Plus, no one is stopping you from taking summer school. You can take up to 4 courses in summer school.

Almost the exact same boat as me, except ive basically decided on Mac. I realized it probably wont matter in the end where I go.

and computer science is direct entry now

Originally Posted by julianface

Almost the exact same boat as me, except ive basically decided on Mac. I realized it probably wont matter in the end where I go.

and computer science is direct entry now

What do you mean by direct entry?

Also earlier I was talking about summer school as in high school 2 week make up course in July.

Technically Mac does not allow summer school deadline extension to submit your marks later.

you aren't in general engineering first year anymore you go right into computer science

Originally Posted by julianface

you aren't in general engineering first year anymore you go right into computer science

Are you sure? The undergraduate calendar states that you have to apply to Computer Science after first year engineering. Can you please link where you found the information?

Originally Posted by jhan523

Are you sure? The undergraduate calendar states that you have to apply to Computer Science after first year engineering. Can you please link where you found the information?

From the undergraduate calendar:

Admission to Level II Computer Science Programs

Admission to Level II Honours Computer Science and Honours Business Informatics requires completion of all non-elective Computer Science I courses with a minimum Cumulative Average (CA) of 4.0. In addition, admission to the Honours Business Informatics program requires completion of ECON 1B03 and 1BB3.
NOTES

1. Both programs have limited enrolment.
2. For the purpose of admission to Level II B.A.Sc. programs, the three courses MATH 1A03, 1AA3 and 1B03 together are considered equivalent to both MATH 1Z04 and 1ZZ5.

Computer science is part of the faculty of engineering, but we are not engineers. Maybe you're thinking of software engineering?

This also means that the restriction on engineering electives doesn't apply to compsci students; see http://registrar.mcmaster.ca /CALEN...nt/pg1197.html

We get a Bachelor of Applied Science degree, not an engineering degree. This is all because computer science was, up until recently, part of the faculty of science. Now we're in the engineering faculty, which makes more sense, but we're not engineers

Originally Posted by MarkA

From the undergraduate calendar:

Computer science is part of the faculty of engineering, but we are not engineers. Maybe you're thinking of software engineering?

This also means that the restriction on engineering electives doesn't apply to compsci students; see http://registrar.mcmaster.ca /CALEN...nt/pg1197.html

We get a Bachelor of Applied Science degree, not an engineering degree. This is all because computer science was, up until recently, part of the faculty of science. Now we're in the engineering faculty, which makes more sense, but we're not engineers

Oh, I see. Yeah I read it wrong. Good think you said something XD

Ugh sorry I'm a little slow and confused lol.

So basically first year I am going into computer science, it is part of engineering faculty but in the end I will be getting a bachelor of science degree?

Also, this mean that I am not taking any physics/chemistry courses? Only one engineering course on safety?


Finally, will the degree I get matter in the end? For example Waterloo gives you a bachelor of mathematics...

Originally Posted by RomanT

Ugh sorry I'm a little slow and confused lol.

So basically first year I am going into computer science, it is part of engineering faculty but in the end I will be getting a bachelor of science degree?

Also, this mean that I am not taking any physics/chemistry courses? Only one engineering course on safety?


Finally, will the degree I get matter in the end? For example Waterloo gives you a bachelor of mathematics...

That's right, you don't need to take any physics or chemistry courses, unless it's needed for upper year courses (You should check all the courses you need to take for prerequisites) or if you want to take them for fun as an elective.

The degree should not matter. You get a B.A.Sc, which I believe is a Bachelor of Arts Science. In the end you graduated from the Computer Science program, so it shouldn't matter when you apply for jobs.