Originally Posted by RTinkess31

... don't engineers have a different chemistry class than science students?

nope first year chemistry is combined with engineers.

btw.

if your a first year and you buy that $300 jacket.. you are an idoit. You do not deserve that jacket. When your well on your way (second year+) only then do you get to wear that jacket. First years should be prevented from wearing it otherwise that jacket has no meaning.

Originally Posted by Infinity

nope first year chemistry is combined with engineers.

btw.

if your a first year and you buy that $300 jacket.. you are an idoit. You do not deserve that jacket. When your well on your way (second year+) only then do you get to wear that jacket. First years should be prevented from wearing it otherwise that jacket has no meaning.

I respectfully disagree.
Isn't it the same thing as me buying some Degroote wear?

I could understand if the jackets were free and it was on a merit basis of some sort... but these people are paying for it. It has no meaning either way, no matter what faculty it is.

Originally Posted by Infinity

nope first year chemistry is combined with engineers.

btw.

if your a first year and you buy that $300 jacket.. you are an idoit. You do not deserve that jacket. When your well on your way (second year+) only then do you get to wear that jacket. First years should be prevented from wearing it otherwise that jacket has no meaning.

I'm pretty sure CHEM 1E03 is specifically for first year engineers.

Also this topic should be LOCKED. OP got his answer.

Its just a jacket people...

Originally Posted by DavidR

Wow.

You don't associate with people based on what they wear? I feel sorry for you.

Thank you for your pity .

I think the thorny issue that has been brought up here is something that shouldnt be ignored or "shoo'ed" under a rug. It isnt the time to get defensive, or try to passive aggresively flame others to gain some form of moral ground. It is something that needs to be discussed because it is a problem. Sure, get the mods to shut down this thread. I will start up another one to discuss viable solutions on how to improve engineering at mac.

The difficulty here is you have non-engineering students who have built up a lot of negativity towards engineers, and engineering students who wont admit that there is a problem, or at most try to explain it away and leave it as it is. Between the two it just looks more like a hissy fit than concerned people working towards a solution. Working towards a solution to these issues benefits everyone.

There is a problem here, and with how things are run. All that gets accomplished by continuing the way we are is more people are churned out of McMaster with negative mentalities. Non-eng people will go forth and promote bad attitudes towards engineers, and eng students will go out being trained to feel superior to others. Right now we have a department on campus that is filled with very bright, hardworking people that, due to certain issues, are achieving very much below their potential.

I dont have the answers, but I know there is a problem and have an idea of where we should be if we fix the problems. I am completely serious that if this problem is discussed and we figure out practical solutions that can be implemented, I will gladly join in presenting the ideas to the faculty/dean/whoever of engineering and be a large proponent for the changes. I'll brainstorm some ideas of things that could be done in between studying and trolling here.

I cant repeat this enough, this is not a time to get defensive or nasty, because neither of those attitudes will lead to any form of productive solution.

Maybe you are all just wayy too sensitive. Next time you see a jerk.... just 'see' them. acknowledge what they are, and don't wish they were anything different.

and rossclot the dislike of engineers isn't just a mcmaster thing.

I believe engineers are still in a different chem, seeing as there is chem 1A03 and chem 1E03.

I'm kind of appalled that most of this topic has been "jackets are ugly" and "people who wear them are douches" and "engineers in general take things too far." So much for MacInsiders being a welcoming place for all to ask questions if this is the response they get.

Oh I know it is everywhere, but we cant affect change everywhere, but at McMaster we can. If we lead the charge it could become a worldwide change. Engineers could go from being troublesome evil sprites to Good witches of the west. Loved by the majority and doing things that justify the sense of pride in engineering.

It could happen.

Originally Posted by andrew22

Next time you see a jerk.... just 'see' them. acknowledge what they are, and don't wish they were anything different.

And please don't base your judgement of that person on what they're wearing. It's 2009.

And what will you do if that change does not happen? Spank me? Oh, you do that. I've been bad.

Originally Posted by VastHorizon

And what will you do if that change does not happen? Spank me? Oh, you do that. I've been bad.

This is getting way too kinky for my liking.

XD

The lady doth protest too much, methinks.

That is all.

Originally Posted by Iman

I believe engineers are still in a different chem, seeing as there is chem 1A03 and chem 1E03.

I'm kind of appalled that most of this topic has been "jackets are ugly" and "people who wear them are douches" and "engineers in general take things too far." So much for MacInsiders being a welcoming place for all to ask questions if this is the response they get.

:/
I think you should re-read the posts.

Some people have said unpleasant things, but most of the posts are about how SOME engineers take the traditions too far and how SOME engineers are douches.

MacInsiders is a welcoming place for people to ask questions. It's also a place where people are allowed to voice their opinions. You'd be a fool to say that "engineer ego" isn't a problem at Mac, and there's nothing wrong with discussing it here.

Some people could be a little nicer with their words, of course, but that doesn't mean no one has a right to talk about why they are unhappy with some other students' actions. I personally believe school vandalism and teaching first years to hate on other faculties is a serious problem, and that kind of thing doesn't get solved by ignoring it.

Originally Posted by Kathy2

Some people could be a little nicer with their words, of course, but that doesn't mean no one has a right to talk about why they are unhappy with some other students' actions. I personally believe school vandalism and teaching first years to hate on other faculties is a serious problem, and that kind of thing doesn't get solved by ignoring it.

If you see students vandalizing, you should report it to security. Some commerce students vandalized the Iron Ring in front of JHE last year, but we didn't go around calling commerce students douches, nor did we take it personally. I don't see how vandalizing is a faculty related thing. Compare it to the amount of vandalism in KTH washrooms and get back to me.

First year students are also not taught to hate on other faculties. In the past few years there has been a large transition to "pro-eng" rather than "anti-others". While I wasn't present for this year's Welcome Week, as president of the Engineering Society last year I received many comments regarding welcome week actions - only one of which was negative and was related to an incident off campus, not involving students. If there was negativity this year, it should have been reported to the Welcome Week planners who, regardless of what you may think, do take their job seriously.

Regardless of faculty, there's going to be a few bad eggs ruining the dozen. I personally don't see any more problem with Engineering than I do with the other faculties. I recall being told to "build a bridge and jump off it" in my first year from Humanities students. If I took things as seriously as you all seem to, I'd be in trouble.

At the end of the day, faculties aside, we're all students and we're all here to get an education. Forget about associations, focus on the individuals - and it'll all work out in the end.