Originally Posted by ShaneM

Yeah. Learn how to put the team on your back. It's hilarious how people are saying "who would ever consider someone from DeGroote" when you can still just impress with your own grades and exit exams. If anything, the entire bell curve of grades should shift downwards, allowing people to shine relative to the average. It just isn't relevant for people to cry over having potentially slightly worse group members when it's a relatively easy obstacle to overcome.

If you don't want to work to get into a good school post-B.com, it's no one's fault but your own.

EDIT: For clarification while I do generally agree that the stream should have a higher average requirement, the justification people have for why it should be higher has been rather selfish and ignoring the larger picture. I do agree with your point of the value of just the B.com degree, though I do not agree with how the average of people will mysteriously drop. This may have been a low year as well considering the previously mentioned point of only being sent to Level 3 students. Just buckle up and make your own average even better if you're in the top bracket.

Employers care much more about seeing a degree from a reputable business school than your grades an exam scores.

I heard that to guarantee your acceptance to DeGroote this year, you need to maintain an 84% AFTER being accepted (last year I think you only had to maintain an 82%). So DeGroote is raising its admission standards. But I find it funny that they're making it easier to stay in the program. It's usually the opposite (ex. a lot of Rotman students get weeded out after first year).

they probably raised the average to 84 because past few years too many ppl have accepted their mac offers and classes/res for first year were gettin full

Originally Posted by DanHiggins

Employers care much more about seeing a degree from a reputable business school than your grades an exam scores.

I know they tend to ask for your GMAT scores.


Not entirely sure about undergrad grades/positions, however. At least I have a semi-relevant source.

commerce... its a competitive field...

But in all seriousness that's pretty bad of McMaster to lower their standards to... is that a C- or a D+? Since when did Honors mean barely passing?

I can't believe they started the letter off with "I am pleased to announce". I guess they like lowering their standards

Originally Posted by chappy89

commerce... its a competitive field...

But in all seriousness that's pretty bad of McMaster to lower their standards to... is that a C- or a D+? Since when did Honors mean barely passing?

Neither. As people already stated, a 5 is a C.

Originally Posted by Brendan

I heard that to guarantee your acceptance to DeGroote this year, you need to maintain an 84% AFTER being accepted (last year I think you only had to maintain an 82%). So DeGroote is raising its admission standards. But I find it funny that they're making it easier to stay in the program. It's usually the opposite (ex. a lot of Rotman students get weeded out after first year).

Admission averages are independent of the average needed to stay in the program. They have X number of first-year spots, and Y number of people applying. They raise (or lower) the average so that they get the top X of Y.

There's a whole slew of other factors that go into changing the requirements to stay in the program.

Lowering standards for honors is one thing, but not letting people take commerce electives while they are in the commerce programme is something very unique to McMaster...

I'd rather see honors standards stay, but allow people to choose commerce electives starting in second year regardless of being in honors or not. I really feel like for the first two years I'm just wasting time.

Originally Posted by ShaneM

Yeah. Learn how to put the team on your back. It's hilarious how people are saying "who would ever consider someone from DeGroote" when you can still just impress with your own grades and exit exams. If anything, the entire bell curve of grades should shift downwards, allowing people to shine relative to the average. It just isn't relevant for people to cry over having potentially slightly worse group members when it's a relatively easy obstacle to overcome.

If you don't want to work to get into a good school post-B.com, it's no one's fault but your own.

EDIT: For clarification while I do generally agree that the stream should have a higher average requirement, the justification people have for why it should be higher has been rather selfish and ignoring the larger picture. I do agree with your point of the value of just the B.com degree, though I do not agree with how the average of people will mysteriously drop. This may have been a low year as well considering the previously mentioned point of only being sent to Level 3 students. Just buckle up and make your own average even better if you're in the top bracket.

While there is truth in what you are saying. I would like to add that commerce is very interactive in that a significant portion of what you learn is from your peers (and employers are aware of this). Hence, most commerce classes involve a lot of group work and discussion. I think employers, who find out about the decision to lower the average to get into the honours program, may perceive this as an unintended signal that the quality of students in the school of business is diminishing. This can only be bad for anyone who graduates from this program, no matter how well they do. I think you are correct in saying that students should worry about themselves and still try their best but that only mitigates the effect not entirely negate it. The effect will obviously have different magnitudes on each student but is nonetheless a setback to graduates and the program

Originally Posted by Fengatron

Lowering standards for honors is one thing, but not letting people take commerce electives while they are in the commerce programme is something very unique to McMaster...

I'd rather see honors standards stay, but allow people to choose commerce electives starting in second year regardless of being in honors or not. I really feel like for the first two years I'm just wasting time.

In second year, you're already taking 8 commerce courses, to show you what kind of stuff you learn in all streams. However, I would've liked it if we were allowed more commerce electives during 3rd year since people in honours can only take 2 commerce electives (while non-honours get 0 commerce electives) that year. The mandatory commerce classes involve no accounting, no IS, and 1 finance (arguably, accounting and finance are the bigger streams with more courses than the other streams in 4th year) so it would've been nice to have a couple more commerce electives to prep for that. This would also help those who are pursuing a CA since most people have to overload (if not been in summer school).

damn, this program was considered average/decent (when i applied 3 years ago) compared to other B-Schools and now after this announcement, they've turned it into a joke. would've preferred it if they raised it to a 7.0. and some how try to gain a bit of credibility in the process. really disappointed.

I'd assume this is so that more people CHOOSE the honours stream, and therefore graduate with a more solid foundation in business, as oppose to taking more non-commerce electives. In the end, 5's and 6's are pretty much the same, but it will allow the 5's to graduate with more commerce electives on their transcripts... that's the only sense I can make out of this decision...

And remember, it's not always about marks, it's everything you put on the table.

If you'd like to voice your opinions to the school directly come out next week.

http://www.facebook.com/events/425044257583980/

I will definitely be bringing up some of the comments above because I disapprove of their decision to dilute the value of "Honours Commerce"

I'm a 2nd year commerce student and I hold roughly a 9 average(?). Honestly, my friends in honours from upper years just tell me to stick to the straight program and do well rather than cumber myself with stresses and silly additional loads of honours as they are finding it difficult to retain their same GPA.

DeGroote.
What are you doing?
DeGroote.
Stahp.