Originally Posted by shes-a-diva*

12,000/year barely covers tuition, food and housing for a school year only. Affordable housing is slowly diminishing, and Ontario's tuitions are the highest in Canada. There isn't really a way to "curb your spending" when an education is so costly.

Also, your loan only gets affected if you work and your parents "make too much money" and even then it doesn't get affected alot. Seriously play around with the online estimator and see that maybe your parents are saving a lot more than their spending, hence why your getting such little money from them.

I'd gladly be 50K in debt with a degree when I graduate, this world's all about education and who you know, and like I previously said without a degree your future career may be in jeopardy. OSAP debt isn't that bad if you make it a priority in its repayment stage. Living at home again would help out with that too.

You do realise that there are other reasons why an incredibly high parental income can result in the child being considered "poor".

Here are some examples:

• Medical bills, especially if you're waitlisted for surgeries and treatments involving debilitating conditions
• A lack of drug plans or prescription medication not covered on any drug plan. My medication would easily cost roughly $150 a month and that's not including the over the counter medication I need.
• Paying for legal services for divorces, adoptions, custody battles, lawsuits against wrongful termination and so on.
• Debt undertaken to immigrate here
• Mortgages on cars and vehicles
• Abusive parents who may deprive their kids of almost everything or who offer the kids money which the child does not want to accept, not wanting anything to do with said parents
• Parents where one partner swindles, gambles or abuses the other wasting their combined combine
• Parents who suffer from drug addiction or alcoholism
• Parents paying for therapy (i.e. psychologists) for themselves, for their children or for all of them after something like a traumatic incident
• Parents who send money to their families in countries without OHIP and drug plans for their medical bills
• And so on.

Money Your Parents Earn =/= Your Tuition.

shesadiva is secretly boxxy.

Originally Posted by A.Marlowe

What's the difference between commuting from Mississauga or living in a $500/ month house with a 12 month lease?

Agony; the 47; Friday nights on the 47; gum on the seats; gum inside the railing.

I can continue but I suggest everybody experience these wonders for themselves.

Originally Posted by lawleypop

shesadiva is secretly boxxy.

I was just going to suggest trolling. But I think we'd hear:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Cdiz0k0Rudw

@ Kathy - Seriously? Seriously? Well I applied for OSAP in 2008 and parently income from the previous year was only required, NOT two years ago income. Also the fact my mother owned a house had nothing to do with it. What DOES affect your OSAP which I was told by an OSAP counseller when asking how much funding my mom would get if she wanted to go to college (she was considering it while off work for so long) is that if you own a car over $5000, your loan gets decreased.


@ A.Marlowe - Really? It's that cheap? So rent + food is under 7000/year, but your not including your 6000 tuition, or your 1000 books. Hmmm... I'm not a math major but that SEEEMS to be over 12,000?? I COULD be wrong, but I don't think I'm that stupid. ALSO, the estimator is accurate. If it didn't ask for your financial information INCLUDING assets, well jeez you could sell your Ferrari and scam the government. (that was a pure sarcasm, don't catch feelings)

Originally Posted by goodnews.inc

You do realise that there are other reasons why an incredibly high parental income can result in the child being considered "poor".

Here are some examples:

• Medical bills, especially if you're waitlisted for surgeries and treatments involving debilitating conditions
• A lack of drug plans or prescription medication not covered on any drug plan. My medication would easily cost roughly $150 a month and that's not including the over the counter medication I need.
• Paying for legal services for divorces, adoptions, custody battles, lawsuits against wrongful termination and so on.
• Debt undertaken to immigrate here
• Mortgages on cars and vehicles
• Abusive parents who may deprive their kids of almost everything or who offer the kids money which the child does not want to accept, not wanting anything to do with said parents
• Parents where one partner swindles, gambles or abuses the other wasting their combined combine
• Parents who suffer from drug addiction or alcoholism
• Parents paying for therapy (i.e. psychologists) for themselves, for their children or for all of them after something like a traumatic incident
• Parents who send money to their families in countries without OHIP and drug plans for their medical bills
• And so on.

Money Your Parents Earn =/= Your Tuition.

Um, yeah the bolded point hold no merit, if life's that bad take action and fend for yourself. LEAVE.

Medical bills? Last time I checked we live in Canada not the US and healthcare is FREE. I've had family undergo surgeries that didn't cost them a penny.

Medication? Do you know how many people require medication for ailments they cannot afford? Having to pay for it on your own is your own perogative, but seriously drug plans only cost 150/month, the same price of your medication. Psychologists are also covered under health plans.

You can't mortgage a vehicle, you can however finance one, but then again if you're buying a car you can't afford maybe you shouldn't buy it?

Costs to immigrate to Canada? Hmm.. I didn't realize you would be in debt for something like this. Pretty sure when my parents came here they saved the money they needed and then busted their behinds off to build what they had.

Divorce? Custody Cases? Being Sued? Been there done that, having a mother who left an abusive relationship to only in turn be sued for 7 years and dragged through the court system, well she remortgaged her house to cover expenses. It was that or be homeless considering my dad launders money and hides his income with his business.

Would it not make more sense to have family immigrate to Canada to take advantage of the free health care instead of sending countless dollars? That's why most of my family now lives in North America.


A lot of you are still missing the point, if your OSAP is affected THAT MUCH by your parent's income, THEY MAKE DECENT MONEY. PERIOD.

Originally Posted by shes-a-diva*

@ A.Marlowe - Really? It's that cheap? So rent + food is under 7000/year, but your not including your 6000 tuition, or your 1000 books. Hmmm... I'm not a math major but that SEEEMS to be over 12,000?? I COULD be wrong, but I don't think I'm that stupid. ALSO, the estimator is accurate. If it didn't ask for your financial information INCLUDING assets, well jeez you could sell your Ferrari and scam the government. (that was a pure sarcasm, don't catch feelings)

My tuition was a lot cheaper for first year because of entry scholarships, and I ended up spending ~$250 on books. Rent at $425 on an 8 month lease was $3 400, which was the largest expense. If I had gone to school closer to home and commuted I could have cut that expense down as well. There's actually a possibility I'll be doing that next year.

Textbooks are non-essential, most classes they are only used to supplement what you learn in lecture. If they are necessary, the university has copies in the library, and everyone has friends in their classes that they can borrow from.

Spending 1k on textbooks every year would be a prime example of poor money management.

Originally Posted by shes-a-diva*

Also for those who aren't lucky enough to get more OSAP because their parents make too much money, I don't quite feel much sympathy for you. Call me ignorant if you must but there must be a reason why your parents wouldn't be willing to contribute to you bettering your quality of life. Maybe your reckless behaviour makes them incline to believe you will waste the money they give you to obtain a degree? Maybe they already buy you designer brand clothing, and anything else you want? Maybe they already spent that one year of university money on your brand new car?

I find it very hard to believe your parents "don't care about you" to want to help you financially.

I hate to jump on this like everybody else has, but I completely disagree. Like others have said, I think this is a very broad generalization. I agree with *some* of the things you have posted and I would say they could apply to some people, but I don't think it's right to generalize.

My parents make more than enough money to fund my tuition. However, they were horrified when they found out I wanted to be a veterinarian (a Doctor of Veterinary Medicine) instead of a human doctor or an engineer. (According to my parents, those are the two best occupations ever and anything other than that is shameful to have in the family .. think stereotypical Asian parents). My dad thinks vets are hippies and that all animals should be eaten and not kept as pets (he doesn't understand that vets are part of the reason why he doesn't get sick from his steak). He doesn't want to pay for my tuition, in hopes that I will change my mind because it's too hard paying for school and studying hard enough to get into vet school, and change my career plans. Until then, he has written me out of his will. (I'm not offended though, he's just doing that because he cares about me and just doesn't understand that you don't have to be an engineer or human doctor to be successful).

Luckily, I anticipated this moment since I was 12 and my dad told me I would shame him forever if I did anything other than being a medical doctor or engineer (they had these plans for me since I was 12). So I started walking dogs for money when I was 12 to start saving money for university and at 14 I started working 30+ hours a week on top of school to make sure I could do what I really really wanted (to preserve the human-animal bond and to protect public health as a veterinarian .. I have wanted to do this since I was 9, much to my dad's irritation).

But I know a LOT of other people in the same situation. Not to stereotype as well, but they also have crazy strict Asian immigrant parents who nearly had heart attacks when tehy found out their kid didn't apply for Health Science and instead only applied to Humanities programs because they secretly want to be a museum curator, or my other friend who applied to OCAD (AND GOT IN!!) and was nearly kicked out of the house.

Call me ignorant if you must but there must be a reason why your parents wouldn't be willing to contribute to you bettering your quality of life. Maybe your reckless behaviour makes them incline to believe you will waste the money they give you to obtain a degree? My reckless behaviour entails getting a 96 average in high school with a 30 hr/wk job + sports, and being on the Dean's list at Mac, and having a desire to help animals. This isn't a fair generalization to make. Maybe they already buy you designer brand clothing, and anything else you want? They provided a roof over my head for 18 years and food on my plate, so I can't complain. However, they don't buy me "anything I want", nor do I ever ask them or anything. I've worked since I was 12 to achieve my own financial independence at 18 and I don't ask them for anything. However, they sometimes visit me at school and bring me food and toilet paper. My parents haven't bought me clothes or other trivial things since I was 13, since I would insist on paying on it myself. Maybe they already spent that one year of university money on your brand new car? I had a car, which I bought entierly by myself, and then sold before coming to university.

I find it very hard to believe your parents "don't care about you" to want to help you financially. It's not because they don't care, but because they REALLY CARE, and are just misguided in thinking that only engineers and medical doctors make good money. They are just upset because most of our relatives don't even understand what a veterinarian is, so it's like, "you immigrated to Canada just so your daughter could play with animals all day?". Understandably they have been upset for the last 3 years for the shame I have brought them when not applying to engineering programs (I'm not being sarcastic).

My point is that there are many reasons why parents don't pay for education, and I don't think it's right to generalize us all into one group with similar characteristics. I'm not saying that I have a rough deal or anything because I don't, I consider myself EXTREMELY lucky, and I am very lucky that if I chose to be an engineer or medical doctor, my parents would be willing to pay for that much education. However I don't think that's my calling, which is why they aren't paying. I dislike drawing attention from random strangers to the fact that my dad is super old fashioned and ignorant, but I really don't think it's fair to say that all people who have parents who have enough money that they cannot qualify for OSAP, but don't pay for their tuition, come from a group that shares either being a spoiled brat or a total screw-up.

Anyway, sorry for the long personal story. Nobody knows who I am anyway here. shes-a-diva, I have a lot of respect for you, and I agree with SOME of the things you have said in other posts, but right now I think you are wrong in stereotyping a large group of people.

Originally Posted by shes-a-diva*

Um, yeah the bolded point hold no merit, if life's that bad take action and fend for yourself. LEAVE.

Medical bills? Last time I checked we live in Canada not the US and healthcare is FREE. I've had family undergo surgeries that didn't cost them a penny.

Medication? Do you know how many people require medication for ailments they cannot afford? Having to pay for it on your own is your own perogative, but seriously drug plans only cost 150/month, the same price of your medication. Psychologists are also covered under health plans.

You can't mortgage a vehicle, you can however finance one, but then again if you're buying a car you can't afford maybe you shouldn't buy it?

Costs to immigrate to Canada? Hmm.. I didn't realize you would be in debt for something like this. Pretty sure when my parents came here they saved the money they needed and then busted their behinds off to build what they had.

Divorce? Custody Cases? Being Sued? Been there done that, having a mother who left an abusive relationship to only in turn be sued for 7 years and dragged through the court system, well she remortgaged her house to cover expenses. It was that or be homeless considering my dad launders money and hides his income with his business.

Would it not make more sense to have family immigrate to Canada to take advantage of the free health care instead of sending countless dollars? That's why most of my family now lives in North America.


A lot of you are still missing the point, if your OSAP is affected THAT MUCH by your parent's income, THEY MAKE DECENT MONEY. PERIOD.

Here's some more information:
Yes, surgeries are free. My sister was born deaf and received a $100,000 surgery that didn't cost us a cent. I know what I'm talking about. I also know what happens when her hearing aids don't work, when she needs batteries for her cochlear, and so forth

Psychologists are not covered under health plans. Psychiatrists are. Psychologists who have private practices send you nice bills from $120 to $200 an hour. Psychiatrists are licensed MD's which is why OHIP will cover the cost.

Well, there are 4 of us and both my brother and myself suffer from a variety of increasingly debilitating respiratory ailments. Our medication is also not covered by any drug plan. Neither is it covered by the 2 jobs my mum works because she doesn't get a drug plan as a benefit. She works in health care and if she could just have purchased a drug plan, I think she would have.

What about parents who have little children who don't want to get up at 8:30 and ride the often unhygenic public transit with mommy to work? How do you plan to get all your groceries to your house when you have 2 little kids and over 30 items worth of groceries on public transit when you may not even be able to get a seat?

Not all families are in your families situation and generalizations like this are costly because not every person you meet will be as willing as we have been to take the time to explain the situation to you. As well, this is reflective of academic ethic because you're demonstrating an inability to consider critical unbiased analysis of a problem. It would really be in your best interest to take a breath and realise that your situation is not widely applicable.

You do understand that not all families can immigrate here? It took us over 7 years to try. When you spend that much time looking for legal services, but try to support a growing family, you don't always have enough money to save.

Laws regarding family sponsorship are changing constantly. The Canadian government is not interested in opening their doors to every family with a sad story as demonstrated by the amount of refugees that are denied entry into the country each year. Instead, they are interested in immigrants who will not only contribute financially to the economy but live here. You can't just bring your whole family just because you want to. As well, it would be hard moving a comatose patient back home or a patient with severe cardiac problems across the ocean instead of taking your salary and paying for their medical bills. It's what's convenient for them, hence, many immigrants continue to send money back home.

Yes, you can leave an abusive home but I'm going to suggest that you reconsider your statement. Are you really going to sit in front of a rape victim who has been abused since they were a child and never told anybody and tell them to "JUST LEAVE"? As well, going back to your original point (which was not about the state of a family because you overrode Kathy's explanation about her family by limiting the scope of your outlook to her family's bank balance) you realise that even if that rape victim does leave, works a part time job, applies for OSAP and lives away from home...by your logic, she shouldn't get any because her abusive dad or mum makes enough to foot the bill.

I may not be understanding your viewpoint with my last statement and if so, please feel free to clarify.
I do know that I'm right about the rest.

ignorant diva is ignorant.

ladyh, can I just say that you're my new hero?

Originally Posted by A.Marlowe

ladyh, can I just say that you're my new hero?

Judging by the username, I'm gonna have to go with heroine... XD

@ ladyh - Its unfortunate that your parents are arrogant and do not realize that such a field is no different that being a doctor. You should try educating them. I know my parents were quite racist at one point in time until I shed light on the matter and changed their views on society. A job is a job, and if it's something that makes you happy the more power to you. The fact your parents don't approve to see you doing something that makes you happy is unfortunate. Education is power (not to say your parents are uneducated) but I mean educating them about the field might change their mind and opinion.

@ goodnews - Hearing aids are covered under health plans, so are psychologists, yes psychologists.

http://www.coverme.com/LH/CoverMe/Co...o_extende dHC

They're considered extended benefits but 12 visits/year are covered and almost the whole hourly cost is covered under a plan. Manulife is one of the providers that provides such coverage as most, if not ALL insurance providers do. Not too sure about the respiratory medication though, I don't think medication can be denied if you have adequate insurance to cover it. I mean a basic plan may not cover it, but an extended coverage plan most likely would.

A vehichle is also considered a luxury as unfortunate as it may seem. Many people, even families can't afford a car whether it be for gas, insurance, or payments on it. Consider yourself lucky your family has a car, there are many people who don't even have parents who drive, or have parents who had to give up driving because of the associate expenses with it.

And in a case with a rape victim, like I stated previously about a friend of mine who was abused by parents and was on welfare prior to finishing highschool, there would be a paper trail of evidence supporting their claim and OSAP would never deny a person the necessary support.


@ EVERYONE - Sorry I'm not allowed to have an opinion, apparently you all feel like you got shafted by OSAP and feel the need to justify yourself. My point remains, OSAP should be increased to cover all expenses associated with post-secondary school, but parental income/assets SHOULD be taken into acount. I mean if your parents have multiple vehicles and multiple homes, a cottage, and you frequently go on vacations out of country, do you honestly think you deserve more money? I mean those are luxuries some people will never get in their life. I believe OSAP is a means of assistance to help break the cycle of poverty, and whether the choose to favor those who are less fortunate, why are you complaining?

*ALSO* If OSAP is really that bad, why don't you write Stephen Harper about it, his solution to cutting down high tuition costs is to increase enrolment, and allow more international students, which I think is rediculous. Maybe you can tell him you want more free money so he can just limit enrolment to international students and you can all sit on your free money.

Originally Posted by shes-a-diva*

My point remains, OSAP should be increased to cover all expenses associated with post-secondary school, but parental income/assets SHOULD be taken into acount. I mean if your parents have multiple vehicles and multiple homes, a cottage, and you frequently go on vacations out of country, do you honestly think you deserve more money? I mean those are luxuries some people will never get in their life. I believe OSAP is a means of assistance to help break the cycle of poverty, and whether the choose to favor those who are less fortunate, why are you complaining?

There we go, finally some sense.

I'm miffed because you went about saying that parents "must not care" and stated wild assumptions about peoples' situations just because they made more money. I didn't get shafted by OSAP either, I quite got what I needed

Originally Posted by temptingf8

There we go, finally some sense.

I'm miffed because you went about saying that parents "must not care" and stated wild assumptions about peoples' situations just because they made more money. I didn't get shafted by OSAP either, I quite got what I needed

The whole parent's not caring part was to paint a picture really. OBVIOUSLY PARENTS CARE. Unless you have degenerate parents, which would be a shame and truely sad. But I mean, a lot of people on here are trying to use the excuse that even though their parents make decent money they don't get any of it. Which in turn makes no sense, because if they HAD MONEY... as their child you are their expense no one elses. Why should the government help those who are financially well off, when there are people who are in more need of the funds?