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Can someone explain the current Middle-East conflict?

 
Old 11-19-2012 at 08:55 PM   #1
Allan
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Can someone explain the current Middle-East conflict?
Can someone explain the current Middle-East conflict? I absolutely know nothing about the politics in that region.

Countries like Canada and the U.S. say Israel has the right to defend itself against terrorist attacks. But then I hear other countries like the UAE saying that they condemn Israel's aggression.

And then there's activists like Anonymous who are taking down Israeli government websites.

Who's the good guy and who's the bad guy? or is it more complicated than that?
Old 11-19-2012 at 09:03 PM   #2
Leeoku
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Whatever preface any1 gives you, it's just to increase foreign relations and gain control over oil

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Old 11-19-2012 at 09:18 PM   #3
RyanC
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Israel is attacking the Gaza strip in response to Hamas shooting rockets at Israel in response to Israel attacking Gaza in response to Hamas shooting rockets at Israel in response to Israel attacking Gaza in response to Hamas shooting rockets at Israel in response to Israel attacking Gaza in response to Hamas shooting rockets at Israel in response to Israel attacking Gaza in response to..... and so on.

Really though, Hamas doesn't even pose a real threat to Israel.. they're lobbing useless rpgs from random locations into random locations in Israel.

The Israeli army is inhumane for attacking a much weaker foe and Hamas is stupid for making pointless attacks that only bring more heat on themselves...

I used to have no stance on this issue, but really, with Iron Dome, other military superiorities, massive backing by the US, and just the non-negotiation stance they keep taking (denying statehood, etc) has made me very negative of the Israeli side.

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Old 11-19-2012 at 09:20 PM   #4
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Its beyond complicated. There has been a long and bloody history over that area, dating far before the end of WW2 saw the formation of the Israeli State. Due to a multitude of reasons that include religion, forced relocation, and continuous border disputes Israel is basically surrounded by people that more or less want them out of the region. Israel however has the support of most of the UN including Russia, UK, and the US. Also they have a vastly superior military, both in training and in technology. These factors have led to Israel being in a state of almost war with one of the regions surrounding it.

In terms of this particular situation Israel was apparently attacked by a series of rockets from the Gaza area. They responded by launching a series of missile strikes into the area to "remove the terrorist presence". The problem most people have with this (including Israels allies) is that the entire region is under control of the Hamas which is a terrorist organization according to NATO countries. As such almost everywhere (including several civilian homes) have become target to Israeli missile attacks, and an estimated over 100 civilians have been killed the last few days.

Whos the bad guy? Really its kinda beyond good and bad at this point. Hamas wants to bring the area back under control of an Islamic state and its military wing operated much like a terrorist group. Israel also has the right to defend itself, and to do so in such a way as to make enemies wary of another attack. But many see Israel's counter attacks to be too strong and wrongly targeting citizens, and that marshaling their army is overkill. Remember Israel has a highly advanced airforce and missile defense grid whereas the Hamas have basically RPG, rifles, etc

Try reading international papers. The BBC has some good ones that try to stay unbias. You could also read into the history of the area a bit. Its quite amazing (and horrible) how volatile it is there and I have little doubt will become a major area of study into human+political+relig ious interaction when/if the region starts to settle down.
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Old 11-19-2012 at 09:37 PM   #5
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Dont want to pick sides but just want to add a tid bit of information that hasnt been mentioned yet, which is that Israel is currently annexing Palestinian land, which is illegal under international law. This is something that has been recognized by the UN, EU (they have a strong stance against the annexing/settlements), and to some extent, the US as well.

Now in terms of my personal opinion, I feel that in terms of warfare, Israel and Hamas should both be condemned. Hamas fires rockets but doesn't/cant (the effect is the same) aim them at military structures/forces/bases/etc, endangering innocent Israeli civilians. As for Israel, well there is countless evidence as to how many innocent women and children they have killed.
However, the reason I slant against Israel is that they are 'currently' instigating the violence. Sure if you look way back it becomes a 'what came first, the chicken or egg game', but many feel that if Israel stopped their illegal settlements, progress in terms of piece would be made. IMO, it is not unreasonable at all for Hamas/Palestine to refuse to go to the peace process table until Israel stops its illegal settlements.

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Old 11-19-2012 at 09:52 PM   #6
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Israel wants Gaza Palestinians to denounce Hamas and give control back to the Palestinian Authority just like they have for the most part in the West Bank. people in Gaza just want the blockade removed and to be able to develop economically, though i can partially understand the need for the blockade to stop weapons and other military stuff flowing to Hamas from Egypt and other allies so that they can target Israel. However with a blockade and without the right to develop economically, and because of high civilian casualties among people in Gaza, people are driven toward extremist/militant groups.... both sides are wrong in this conflict- Israel for their blockade and the illegal settlements and Hamas for firing the rockets and other missiles at Israel.
Old 11-19-2012 at 09:55 PM   #7
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One reason for everything out there - moneys. People love moneys, and will always want more moneys. And since political/social/religious opposition usually decreases the income of moneys. It is preferable to get rid of any political/social/religious opposition in order to increase amount of moneys.
Old 11-19-2012 at 10:28 PM   #8
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At this point both sides are both the good guy and the bad guy.
I found an article a couple of weeks ago that kind of epitomizes the conflict...it was about Palestinian refugee schools, how the UN wanted them to be taught a curriculum that included the Holocaust, and the Palestinians didn't want their children to be taught that because they didn't want them to have sympathy for the people who forced them out of their homes and took their land and killed their family members. They didn't want Israelis to be portrayed as victims. Each side feels so wronged by the other that neither is willing to back down. This doesn't really explain the history of the conflict or anything like that, but goes a long way to explaining the people's attitudes about it, and why it's more complicated than it might seem.

On the other side of it, I also saw an article about a tour company offering tours of the area, each one led by one Israeli and one Palestinian, and each would offer their viewpoints and the history that they were taught. Not fighting about it, or one trying to claim that they are right over the other, but simply explaining what the history is from their perspective. I think it's an excellent example of working together, and combating the negative attitudes that were seen in the school article.
Old 11-19-2012 at 11:00 PM   #9
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Basically the current problem is Hamas if firing rockets into Israel, but since Hamas isn't a conventional force and Israel is, there isn't a whole lost Israel can do but to fire rockets to take out the "terrorists", which then looks like Israel is using excessive force. So Hamas is being an idiot for pointlessly attacking a more powerful country, and whatever Israel do looks excessive and aggressive, so they are condemned.

Israel also has what's called, the "Iron Dome" (I think it's dome) which is a missile defense shield, which shoots down about 1/3-2/3 of the rockets that are aimed at them which is why they look more aggressive depending what side you are on since a lot of the rockets aren't actually causing causalities, while all of Israel's cause casualties/injuries on the Gaza side
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Old 11-19-2012 at 11:29 PM   #10
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Not actually a dome, just a SAM interceptor.

Business as usual in the Gaza strip: Hamas shooting rockets at civilian centers in Israel. They shoot down most of them, but still some rockets hit.

Israel recently decides mount a counter-offensive. But since Hamas appears to use civilians as shielding for their military targets (schools, attaching communication equipment in Journalism district), there is collateral damage of civilians.
Old 11-19-2012 at 11:40 PM   #11
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Here is the best video on the internet which explains the problems. It all started as a real estate transaction. I highly recommend the channel as well. It really explains 100% of both sides of many news events.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wb6IiSUxpgw

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Old 11-20-2012 at 12:19 AM   #12
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Netanyahu is up for reelection soon, it is possibly that this attack on Gaza is to gain support from Israeli a citizens. If this is the case, things aren't likely to escalate as Israelis don't really want a ground invasion.
Old 11-20-2012 at 08:45 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eniteris View Post
Not actually a dome, just a SAM interceptor.

Business as usual in the Gaza strip: Hamas shooting rockets at civilian centers in Israel. They shoot down most of them, but still some rockets hit.

Israel recently decides mount a counter-offensive. But since Hamas appears to use civilians as shielding for their military targets (schools, attaching communication equipment in Journalism district), there is collateral damage of civilians.
So based on your post the 'collateral damage', i.e. killing of innocent children, is the fault of Hamas and not Israel. You do know that even based on the absurd possibility that all those dead children were used as shields, Israel would still have had to launch a rocket in the vicinity of children ...
Old 11-20-2012 at 08:47 AM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snowman View Post
Basically the current problem is Hamas if firing rockets into Israel, but since Hamas isn't a conventional force and Israel is, there isn't a whole lost Israel can do but to fire rockets to take out the "terrorists", which then looks like Israel is using excessive force. So Hamas is being an idiot for pointlessly attacking a more powerful country, and whatever Israel do looks excessive and aggressive, so they are condemned.

Israel also has what's called, the "Iron Dome" (I think it's dome) which is a missile defense shield, which shoots down about 1/3-2/3 of the rockets that are aimed at them which is why they look more aggressive depending what side you are on since a lot of the rockets aren't actually causing causalities, while all of Israel's cause casualties/injuries on the Gaza side
You say 'pointlessly attacking' ... from what I understand, Palestine is under military occupation. There is a blockade in place, and their land is being annexed. Fighting back against these conditions is pointless?
Old 11-20-2012 at 09:52 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by husayn12 View Post
So based on your post the 'collateral damage', i.e. killing of innocent children, is the fault of Hamas and not Israel. You do know that even based on the absurd possibility that all those dead children were used as shields, Israel would still have had to launch a rocket in the vicinity of children ...
BOTH sides have killed children, amongst other civilians, as "collateral damage".

Quote:
Originally Posted by husayn12 View Post
You say 'pointlessly attacking' ... from what I understand, Palestine is under military occupation. There is a blockade in place, and their land is being annexed. Fighting back against these conditions is pointless?
I believe that what was meant by that post was that since Israel has a much stronger military, Palestine doesn't have the capability to defeat them. So, they can fight back all they want, and whether or not you believe their actions are justified is irrelevant because their military just isn't strong enough to beat Israel's. Kind of like you get mugged by five armed people. You can try to fight back, and some people would argue that you SHOULD fight back, so at least you have a chance, or you go down fighting without giving up, or whatever...but if it's you alone against five armed people, you're gonna lose.

Edit: http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-20407506

Last edited by starfish : 11-20-2012 at 10:03 AM.



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