Originally Posted by VastHorizon

I don't think drop-out rates are relevant. It just means that people have no desire to carry on
with the program - maybe they just lost interest and thought that it was not really for them.

I agree, but I also think it's a push and a pull. I know not everyone dropping out does it because of the workload, but I still am curious.

Originally Posted by harris3

the reason the average is low is because the class is hard, the class average would never be that low in another faculty. plus a pretty high percentage of people drop out as well, and its not as if their all idiots, they were all the best students in math/physics at their respective high schools and couldnt handle it, so its not like the people who get 60's are just cruising through getting 60's and 70's.

Oh come on lol. Drop outs shouldn't be correlated with difficulty, there are tons of other factors such as finding another passion or deciding engineering is not for them (without necessarily failing) at play.

Your entire post is so defensive lol...and full of inaccuracies.
They were the best students in math/physics at their respective high schools? No, they weren't. But if you really want to compare this way with no evidence besides anecdotes then let's compare: engineering requires low 80s to get in...life science is at 88 and health sci is at 90+. At my high school, I know people including myself who got 98+ in stats, 96+ in physics, 94+ in calculus....and they all went into life science, not engineering. In fact, out of our top 5 highest averages in grade 12, 3 went into life sci at mac, 1 into life sci at U of T, and one into eng at U of T.

And maybe the ones in eng "couldn't handle it" because they're lazy or not as smart as they thought they were.

I'm good friends with a few engineers and most of them are above 11.7 GPA, and not one of them assumes that they're that much better than anyone else. In fact, these are all completely average intelligence, average work-ethic students.

I doubt that people who were "at the top of their math and physics classes" would be failing in undergrad unless they were either lazy, or their high school was very easy, or they just didn't care.

Slept yet? Take Vast, hasnt slept in 72 hours. How many people in other faculties do that?

Originally Posted by Alchemist11

Oh come on lol. Drop outs shouldn't be correlated with difficulty, there are tons of other factors such as finding another passion or deciding engineering is not for them (without necessarily failing) at play.

Your entire post is so defensive lol...and full of inaccuracies.
They were the best students in math/physics at their respective high schools? No, they weren't. But if you really want to compare this way with no evidence besides anecdotes then let's compare: engineering requires low 80s to get in...life science is at 88 and health sci is at 90+. At my high school, I know people including myself who got 98+ in stats, 96+ in physics, 94+ in calculus....and they all went into life science, not engineering. In fact, out of our top 5 highest averages in grade 12, 3 went into life sci at mac, 1 into life sci at U of T, and one into eng at U of T.

And maybe the ones in eng "couldn't handle it" because they're lazy or not as smart as they thought they were.

I'm good friends with a few engineers and most of them are above 11.7 GPA, and not one of them assumes that they're that much better than anyone else. In fact, these are all completely average intelligence, average work-ethic students.

I doubt that people who were "at the top of their math and physics classes" would be failing in undergrad unless they were either lazy, or their high school was very easy, or they just didn't care.

lol science fffewf

Originally Posted by J. Dorey

I can't speak for Music as I've never taken a class in that program, but English is often seen as one of the harder arts courses to major in. The reading for it is insane. You have to read a novel, spend 3 lectures on it, and you're on to the next one. The pace of reading is pretty difficult, especially when you factor in the supplementary readings for the assignments and what not. And the majority of the assignments... if you can't prove your point well enough, your screwed.

I can speak for music, not english though. Although some of our schedules may be sparse it's the amount of work we put into it outside of classes, and first year music students actually take 33 units just like eng students. Some of us put in quite a few extra hours of practicing everyday and it's not really something you can just cram for.

Not sure how true this is, but I heard the Mo-mac Radiation Sciences program is the hardest program at the university.

Really makes me question whether I should be applying next year. I mean, I work hard, but I'm no genius or anything...

Originally Posted by mastercool

Not sure how true this is, but I heard the Mo-mac Radiation Sciences program is the hardest program at the university.

Really makes me question whether I should be applying next year. I mean, I work hard, but I'm no genius or anything...

That's the first I've heard someone say that...

You should really just try it and decide for yourself. No one else can tell you how hard/easy you will find a program.

Originally Posted by mastercool

Not sure how true this is, but I heard the Mo-mac Radiation Sciences program is the hardest program at the university.

Really makes me question whether I should be applying next year. I mean, I work hard, but I'm no genius or anything...

People in the Med Rad program have told me otherwise.