[lorend]

Faculty Wars: Lame!

By DANIELLE LORENZ, MACINSIDERS

As the school year is quickly approaching, I’d like to bring forth an issue that is important to many students at McMaster: the biases there are between different programs, and how some are apparently

more superior than others. Although this superiority complex seems to be prevalent in more faculties than others, it still happens...and it doesn’t need to.

I am absolutely tired of hearing that my degree (or degrees...I’m technically on my second, having graduated from a combined Soc Sci/Humanities degree in June) is an easy one to get. If it was as easy as everyone thinks it is, wouldn’t I be getting 12’s on everything? I don’t, and I’m not the only one. I have yet to hear of anyone I know who has gotten a 12 in an English or Cultural Studies course. Easy my big, fat butt!!

I’ve also heard how our degree is so much easier because we have less hours of class. The typical Humanities or Social Science course load has fifteen hours of class a week. Yes, we have a lot less class than you...but we have to spend a lot more of our out-of-class time preparing for our classes. The rest of the time we spend writing essays; and let me tell you, a (good) ten page paper takes more than ten hours of writing, which does not include research and editing.

Furthermore, we get less help from our profs and the department. We do not often get notes on WebCT, nor do we have test banks. If we don’t go to class there is no way for us to make up what we missed, as reading the textbook just doesn’t cut it when you have to analyze and interpret on an exam. Maybe I would get a 12 if I had all of those things to supplement everything else I do. Until then, I’ll have to work my butt (yes, my big, fat butt) off and see how close I can get.

That’s my own personal gripe with the attitudes that some people have at McMaster (at the keynote speech last week given by a Commerce Alumnus he seemed to have similar opinions about Humanities and Soc Science that I raised above). That and the spatula taunts...however, I know it’s not just students in the Social Sciences and Humanities that face the same prejudices against their program.

Last year, at the MacPass tent, one of the Health Sci reps (the Pathogens...also in blue suits like the Blue Suits [Soc Sci Reps]) said something really stupid to a first year student. They said that the student had no chance of getting into medical school with a science degree. A Sci Co quickly retorted: "Don't you realize we have other programs like Geo, Chemistry, Physics, etc. that don't necessarily lean towards med school? Good luck getting a job when you fail your MCAT."

Admittedly, the response was a little bit inappropriate, but the Path did not have the right to put a student down like that. Talk about lame and immature! And I’d also like to mention that you don’t have to be in the Sciences or Health Sciences to go to medical school; Humanities and Social Science do too. (For more info, read this and this article about medical school).

Similarly, Math students and Engineering students often get into superiority arguments. Soc Sci students often think they’re better than Humanities students. Physical Science majors say that Biology is an inferior science. The arguments go on and on, but to no avail. They really don’t mean anything in the end. Those who stick by them are nothing but close-minded, immature people.

Consider the following: people are usually in their degree program because that is what they are good at. For example, I am not the best at math (partially because there is no practical application for calculus to me), so I stay away from it. Some people are not good at writing essays, so they stay away from courses that are essay-intensive. We all learn differently, and we all have our own skills and challenges. A lot of faculty bashing occurs during Welcome Week, and it tends to give people the wrong impression about other programs.

Remember to think for yourself, and to stay away from the close-minded, stereotypical thoughts! You never know when you will need help from people outside your faculty! I had my Eng friends help me with Calculus, and I helped them by editing their lab reports.

[temara.brown]

At the same time, it's great to develop pride in your faculty. Connecting with it will help strengthen the bond between yourself and other students studying in the faculty, your professors, ta's, etc. It will likely also make it easier to help figure out what's going on in your faculty or even get help on assignments.
But, if you have to make fun of another faculty to prop yourself up, then that is just weak.
Although most of the time things are for fun you never know when they may just cross the line = sadness.


Here goes a plug for the origins program:

Origins is an INTER-DISIPLINARY science that works to build collaboration between all the sciences.. seems like a very fitting idea for this article <3 origins.

[Phoenix]

Thanks so much for writing this, it's about time! Well said, I'm tired of also getting the same treatment from other faculties that think that just because I'm in Humanities, that I'll be flipping burgers for a living. If you ask me Humanities opens the door for many other jobs that most people would not even think a BA would be associated with. Thanks so much Danielle for putting this out there before Welcome Week. Hopefully the new first-years will understand that they are not being put down in any way just because of their faculty.

[samantha__]

Oh yes.. the hardcore members of each faculty. The ones that actually go out of their way to diss other people. Often times, I find that those making poor judgement and rude comments about other faculties are the ones that are rather insecure about themselves and their own faculty.

Surprisngly, even though I'm now in Economics, I have never recieved the "Wow, youre in SS? You're gonna be a spatula flipper" response. I guess it all depends on people's views of the subject you're in (Economics is very similiar to Business, which is probobly why people haven't been like AHHHHH to me).

I don't see the point in fighting about all this. Not everyone in Humanities or SS is going to have a job involving a spatula, not everyone in Health Sci or Science will become a doctor, etc etc

[kokosas]

Originally Posted by Phoenix

Thanks so much for writing this, it's about time! Well said, I'm tired of also getting the same treatment from other faculties that think that just because I'm in Humanities, that I'll be flipping burgers for a living. If you ask me Humanities opens the door for many other jobs that most people would not even think a BA would be associated with. Thanks so much Danielle for putting this out there before Welcome Week. Hopefully the new first-years will understand that they are not being put down in any way just because of their faculty.

I agree with both you and Temera. I love what I study with a passion, I'm not involved with my faculty society because I chose other avenues to get involved but that doesn't mean I'm not proud of us.

I've stopped letting the whole degree bashing thing get to me because I realized when someone I thought was my friend basically told me that I was in the stupid-people faculty and that her classes were better and harder that those people are only ignorant and narrow minded and that one day they'll be faced with a challenge that they can't overcome and they'll realize that they need help from someone in a different discipline. I just let it roll off me because at the end of the day, I'm enjoying what I do and I know that I have career oportunities out there for me that I'm excited for, that's all that matters to me.

But just keep this in mind: sometimes people don't enter a certain faculty because they can't do it, they just weren't any good at it in high school and that's not something to be held against them. There are also people who simply didn't like the subjects of those faculties and so chose something that they liked over something they happened to be good at. Judge someone based on who they are and how they act, not what they study.

[Nino]

I'm going to be entering first year Life Science in September and honestly, I have heard so many discouraging comments, not only from McMaster students but from students from other universities as well. The common one is "You're trying to go to med school? You're screwed...Do you know how hard it is? If you don't get in you'll be pretty much a hobo". My reply usually is thanking them for their "support" and telling them that if that's what I want to do then I'm going to do it and I obviously realize that it's difficult but just because it's difficult does not mean it can't be done. With hard work anything can be accomplished. Determination and hard are the key to succcess and honestly, with both, anything can be accomplished. So with that being said, screw all the put downs. Contine doing what you enjoy doing and what you want to do and don't let anybody tell you you're not good at something or you can't do something. Whether you can or can't do something is totally up to you and how much effort you put into it. (I know it all sounds corny but yeah it's just a few things I learned while I was an exec at my student council at school )

[Phoenix]

Another thing I find, in addition to faculty bashing, there is alot of program bashing as well. As an Honours History student, I find that many people think that History is all memorization. Some of my close friends, one in particular who is in commerce says that all I have to do to study is memorize a bunch of dates. Forgive me if I'm wrong, but I personally find University History much more difficult and different that high school history. If anyone is thinking that History is just a bunch of memorization, I highly suggest that you take a history course, and see whats in store. History is not only memorization, its argumentative, its thinking outside the box. I personally find I think very differently than other students in different programs or faculties because I'm trained to think outside the box. Just because I'm in history doesn't necessarily mean I'm going to be a teacher. Although I do want to be a teacher, programs like history can open many doors such as the doors to law school! The amount of ignorance that some people have is just mind boggling!

[jmbauman]

Loves!

One of the best things I've heard since starting at Mac was that Law schools accept more History majors than pre-law because we rock at critical thinking. It seems so simple to formulate arguments (because being in History I do it all the time) but it's not so simple for others. But then my housemate (in theoretical physics) shows me his text book and I cry. Which is easier? hmmm

Faculty Wars are lame. (but the cheers for each faculty are amazing, and make me want to be in every single one! oohhhh Welcome Week, how I miss you!)

[samantha__]

YAAA, every faculty has it's own way of doing things, but in the end, we're all part of McMaster University and I feel that that should be enough for people to be nicer to each other

I was considering doing History because of Law School but then I was unsure of the career ops for history if I didnt go to Law School. Either way, history is the bomb

[McIntyre]

Hey...as a science student...I just want to add that there really shouldn't be any bashing. Everyone goes into a program that reflects their interests and to be honest, I could not handle a Humanities or Social Science major. My interests are in science and I really would do 10 times worse if I was in a Humanities or Social Science program, and I completely respect those people in those programs because it is something that I actually cannot do!

[mitch]

Being in Kin, I hear a lot of bashing. People think that it's all about gym and sports. Sometimes, I need to even explain my program to professors. For example, when I was applying to my current research job, I had to explain that there were two programs to kin; a science degree and a social science degree. Sure there are some courses about gym and coaching, but the majority of courses (the ones I take) focus on science, anatomy, physiology and other similar topics. I think everyone's program has similar amounts of easy and difficult courses.

[feonateresa]

Honestly, thank you for this article. It's so frustrating, being in social sciences -- even though I haven't even started yet!

When I was growing up, I was really interested in the sciences. But soon after highschool, I started to lose that interest. There came grade 11 psychology, anthropology and sociology. I found my calling. I loved psychology to death and knew I wanted to pursue it. Then came all the negative comments, "Oh everyone does psychology if they're not good at anything or if they can't achieve much, why do you think there's always so many students going into first year psych?" Oh, maybe because it's interesting? Still, I got those sorts of comments a lot and it bothered me so much that I ended up seriously doubting it.

Then I hit grade twelve and all of my high marks were from law, english, family studies, writers craft, basically social science/humanities courses, then I knew I had to continue on my path. Not only because I did well, because I thoroughly enjoyed those classes.

Everyone has a different path that they themselves are supposed to follow. Some of us go to university, some of us choose to work. Some of us decide to go into sciences, some of us go into social sciences. It doesn't make sense for someone to bash or not like someone else because of what they do, rather than their actions and their character. It's ridiculous and needs to stop. It just perpetuates the idea that some people are higher than others in society based on stupid beliefs.

[Sohaibb]

Good article.

And it just flashed one of my favourite quotes through my head.. "Love is silencing your critiques"

[jhan523]

I've never taken psychology before. I also hear people saying it's easy stuff. But honestly, how easy can it be to study the mind? It's so complicated... At least to me it is.

[kokosas]

Originally Posted by jhan523

I've never taken psychology before. I also hear people saying it's easy stuff. But honestly, how easy can it be to study the mind? It's so complicated... At least to me it is.

My general rule of thumb with courses is this: If it's a university approved course then it's going to challenge you in some, if not all ways. Some of us might do better at it given our skills and interests than others but it's a university course for a reason, that doesn't mean it's like Civics and Careers class in high school (where my teacher made us watch the Lion King the first day so we could 'identify with simba's struggles'... ie: she didn't want to teach us).