I have been accepted into both McMaster and Queens for life sciences. From what I have read, both schools offer similar programs, at least in the initial year. In your opinion, what's the most compelling reason to choose Mac over Queens?

McMaster's strength is health and life sciences. It is what this University is known for. McMaster is consistently ranked in the top 50 for life sciences.

http://www.topuniversities.c om/uni...alse+sea rch=

Queen's is a great school too but McMaster has a more reputable life sciences program

Most biological science programs at the undergraduate level are about the same so it doesn't really matter where you go. I think McMaster is more of a research school than a learning school. From experience a lot of the biological science profs are not the best, either they don't give a shit or they don't really know how to get ideas across to students (i.e. reading powerpoint slides word for word to students). They may be doing some interesting research but their lectures are far from interesting. For a field like the biological sciences where you're memorizing trivial facts like a robot for 4 years, it really helps when the prof is actually enthusiastic, can engage the class and get the main points across as it helps you recall the information later. Of all the bio/biochem courses I've taken so far, I've only had one decent prof.

Wow, thanks for the honest answer. As a highschool student, I don't really have access to this sort of information, so it really helps. Did the poor profs affect your experience at mac? Did you stay in your original program after realizing the profs didn't seem to care? Finally, do you think this is a great enough reason to choose an alternate university? Thanks.

My first year was alright. It was only this year, my second year, where I actually noticed the declining quality of the profs a lot more. Like I always see how people are always posting everywhere with these ranking lists that show McMaster is on the top, but in my opinion those don't really mean much. My program (Molecular Biology) did not turn out to be my cup of tea and I'm switching to another program because I know that certain profs that I disliked this year will be teaching the next sets of courses next year. I'm not trying to bash McMaster Life Science, it's just that this program and its specializations requires a different type of learning. It's kind of hard for me to describe, but it's kind of like you're expected to just learn everything on your own and it feels as if the prof doesn't really exist or is rather distant, and only provides the same amount (or less) than the textbooks.

But some people like that type of independent learning where you don't need to rely on the prof and you can just read the textbook and memorize everything and do well in the courses. However, I don't really like this type of learning. So it really depends on your learning style. I'm not really sure if you should choose an alternate university. It's hard to determine what works for you without actually having attended any upper year classes. The only thing I can suggest is to go on the facebook groups for the incoming classes for McMaster and Queens and ask for the opinions of multiple upper year students (probably shouldn't ask any students who just finished first year) as they can give you a better idea of what types of learning style each program requires.

But take any advice anyone tells you with a grain of salt, as some people's opinions may vary greatly. I mean, I'm not sure if I'm just super pessimistic, but I feel like some people try too hard to convince people to come to Mac by saying things like "we're ranked really high up", "the profs really care about you", etc. but it's really your learning style that matters. At the same time, I'm not trying to drive you away, but choosing a university is a big decision; the point of going to school is to learn and I feel like I just wasn't really getting that aspect in my program and it doesnt seem to make sense to go to a school based on reputation/ranking if theyre not delivering the learning portion properly.

You have to understand that you won't get a good answer to a question like "should I choose school A over school B" because most of the people you talk to will only have gone to one of those schools - so they know about as much about the other school as you do - and because everybody learns differently, and also imo it is more than just the classes that make a school a good choice for a person.

Why not just use University Rankings in your respected field to make a choice?

Thank you all for the speedy responses. When I was first faced with this choice, I decided I'd try and look at it from every possible angle. This discussion has given a great dimension, and brought light to a few issues I hadn't thought enough about. For now, I'll be posting a very similar question on the Queens forum, to see what they have to say. Thanks for the help and advice.

Originally Posted by A.Sarracini

Thank you all for the speedy responses. When I was first faced with this choice, I decided I'd try and look at it from every possible angle. This discussion has given a great dimension, and brought light to a few issues I hadn't thought enough about. For now, I'll be posting a very similar question on the Queens forum, to see what they have to say. Thanks for the help and advice.

Go with Queen's. Honestly, since McMaster's biology department do not even affiliate with the faculty of health sciences, their research and lectures are most of the time, irrelevant to topics that I am interested in. For instance, if you are interested in Cancer, cardiovascular disease, stem cell or neurodegenerative disease, the faculties are unable to provide courses on molecular pathology behind those things since they lack the expertise in them. Being in the molecular biology/life sciences program, I honestly disliked how it is so distant from medicine and biomedical research in general.

Hi Andrew!

Congrats on your acceptances to both Queen's & McMaster!

At the end of the day, whether you go to Queen's or McMaster likely won't make a huge difference. I will note that one unique thing about McMaster is that it offers co-op programs for several science programs, even general ones like Life Science (if you decide to stay in Life Science in 2nd year instead of specializing).

This was a huge benefit for me, because I really wanted to stay in Life Science because of its flexibility and very little restrictions, and I think that was a huge reason why I was able to do well. Most other universities will offer co-op programs for specialized science fields like Biochemistry or Genetics, but I wasn't interested in those. That's why McMaster was a great fit for me! A co-op program is really invaluable especially to science where the experience you gain in co-op can really put you ahead of your fellow science grads.

McMaster is a really great school for the sciences. First year was a major review of high school, and I didn't find it difficult. Yes, you will have to study almost everyday to keep with your courses but if you have good time management (ex: don't only start studying for your midterms in the week they're coming up), and you keep up with the content of your classes weekly, you will be in good shape to do well. I found Life Science a very fair program if you put the effort in, there's a lot of flexibility and freedom in picking your courses, and co-op is a huge plus!

One thing to note is that the McMaster Life Science program is going through a huge change, where they are planning to make it a bit more specialized (i.e. more mandatory lab courses, more mandatory research courses, more required courses). Look into these changes, they aren't too major, but some of the changes they're introducing include two brand new 2nd year courses (one is a lab course, and the other is a research course), a mandatory 4th year Life Science Research/Seminar course, and a mandatory 3rd year research course, and a mandatory placement/thesis course (you can pick either). I think these changes are occurring because it is possible to go through the Life Science program and have many minimal exposure to science courses after 1st year (ex: a lot of Life science students can take Psychology and Geography courses to fulfill their course requirements) and to make you a more well-rounded graduate in science.

Originally Posted by bradyr

Hi Andrew!

Congrats on your acceptances to both Queen's & McMaster!

At the end of the day, whether you go to Queen's or McMaster likely won't make a huge difference. I will note that one unique thing about McMaster is that it offers co-op programs for several science programs, even general ones like Life Science (if you decide to stay in Life Science in 2nd year instead of specializing).

This was a huge benefit for me, because I really wanted to stay in Life Science because of its flexibility and very little restrictions, and I think that was a huge reason why I was able to do well. Most other universities will offer co-op programs for specialized science fields like Biochemistry or Genetics, but I wasn't interested in those. That's why McMaster was a great fit for me! A co-op program is really invaluable especially to science where the experience you gain in co-op can really put you ahead of your fellow science grads.

McMaster is a really great school for the sciences. First year was a major review of high school, and I didn't find it difficult. Yes, you will have to study almost everyday to keep with your courses but if you have good time management (ex: don't only start studying for your midterms in the week they're coming up), and you keep up with the content of your classes weekly, you will be in good shape to do well. I found Life Science a very fair program if you put the effort in, there's a lot of flexibility and freedom in picking your courses, and co-op is a huge plus!

One thing to note is that the McMaster Life Science program is going through a huge change, where they are planning to make it a bit more specialized (i.e. more mandatory lab courses, more mandatory research courses, more required courses). Look into these changes, they aren't too major, but some of the changes they're introducing include two brand new 2nd year courses (one is a lab course, and the other is a research course), a mandatory 4th year Life Science Research/Seminar course, and a mandatory 3rd year research course, and a mandatory placement/thesis course (you can pick either). I think these changes are occurring because it is possible to go through the Life Science program and have many minimal exposure to science courses after 1st year (ex: a lot of Life science students can take Psychology and Geography courses to fulfill their course requirements) and to make you a more well-rounded graduate in science.

Thanks for the reply! For me, Mac's option for co-op is major, and it has influenced my decision making process greatly. From what I have heard from others, co-op gives the student an opportunity to make connections in the working world (which is very important for me), and gives a chance to make money while working in your discipline.

To my knowledge, Queens does not have a life sciences co-op option, which should have helped to make my choice relatively easy. However, there have been multiple counts of users on this thread who are either not happy with their choice, didn't get what they were expecting, or don't have good things to say about Mac life sciences. These responses are a little worrying, and have been playing on my mind for a while now, (thank you all for honest responses).

The deadline for accepting offers is June first. I will need to decide in a short amount of time, and I am sure that there is "no wrong choice here". Anyway, thank you for the response, and input.

Did you happen to apply to uWaterloo? If coop is something you really want to do I recommend Waterloo simply because the majority of their science programs start coop in the winter of second year, whereas here at McMaster coop starts in the winter/summer of third year which is about a whole year later.

Originally Posted by Imperious

Did you happen to apply to uWaterloo? If coop is something you really want to do I recommend Waterloo simply because the majority of their science programs start coop in the winter of second year, whereas here at McMaster coop starts in the winter/summer of third year which is about a whole year later.

I did not apply to Waterloo, mostly because my experience on their campus tour, where I was not really impressed. After doing some research, I found that they are a top engineering and computer school, but are not well known for sciences. Due to this, I decided to not include Waterloo in my choices.

Originally Posted by gggggg

Go with Queen's. Honestly, since McMaster's biology department do not even affiliate with the faculty of health sciences, their research and lectures are most of the time, irrelevant to topics that I am interested in. For instance, if you are interested in Cancer, cardiovascular disease, stem cell or neurodegenerative disease, the faculties are unable to provide courses on molecular pathology behind those things since they lack the expertise in them. Being in the molecular biology/life sciences program, I honestly disliked how it is so distant from medicine and biomedical research in general.

The good thing because of Life Sci's large elective space, you can take more of these courses which are offered by Health Sci. All you need to do is send a quick email asking for permission, and usually they'll say yes. And if you are interested in neurodegenerative disease Life Sci is the best route to go, Health Sci offers 0 courses in that route. Life Sci 3bb3, Life Sci 3k03, Life Sci 4xx3 all have things to do with neuro diseases