And for this week, I will bring candy.

one more point to add that I don't think was brought up enough in my last two points....

this whole thing is absurd. DVDs have absolutely nothing to do with any of my academics and I can't say I know any other's who say they are. On top of that, I hear there's already a DVD library on campus already!!!!!

Ok, I realise now that this topic has been thoroughly discussed but i have a quick point

I would not have known about this were it not for this post. There is NOTHING around JHE, where I basically LIVE. Even if i checked websites, i wouldnt have heard anything. hey, yoohoo, MSU and stuff, if theres something important going on want to email us?
What about all the other engineers that DONT go on macinsiders? or even facebook?

Also, any kind of censorship is completely a stupid idea. ESPECIALLY on the internet. The internet cant be censored. (except in china i guess) but its a free medium, and what if i make a bogus account and no one can trace me and i post stuff.. whaddya gonna do then huh?
nothing.
thats what i thought.

this situation is about the stupidest thing ive ever heard about with school related stuff. and we have pretty stupid and useless stuff going on.

No problem Temara...

Did you guys take into consideration that maybe the people who signed the forms were forced into it? Maybe those people weren't left alone and were being harassed to sign it. How would I know? Well, I was one of those people. I told them straight up that this would never go through. However, I didn't at all appreciate being forced to do something I didn't want to do. That's not the MSU's fault and they are not involved with that. However, I'd like to point out that I wasn't the only one who was forced into signing that stupid piece of paper. Also, how long did it take them to get those papers signed? Yeah 3% signed those papers but how many of those 3% are actually still at Mac? How many of those 3% actually even want this to go through? People, sometimes, sign shit that they don't read or are coerced into signing. Consider that. I really don't believe this referendum will go through. The residence students which is a good 3000+ students have their DC++ and like Temara said, realistically we download movies. I don't rent movies and I haven't since back when I was still in high school. I don't think movies are a huge influence in our lives right now. We'll watch them when we can. However, I find that dentistry, our health plan and all of those other things that the MSU offers are generally much more important than having DVD rentals.

It should be noted that the MSU could have conducted this referendum in the spring while all those people were still here.

Yes, sometimes students just sign petitions. The MSU must respect the petition. To their credit they are respecting it.

Originally Posted by fullsmash26

It should be noted that the MSU could have conducted this referendum in the spring while all those people were still here.

Yes, sometimes students just sign petitions. The MSU must respect the petition. To their credit they are respecting it.

it was stated before that the MSU came to a decision that there was not adequate time to run the referendum before this october election.

i agree completely. the msu would have no right deciding whether or not a petition is valid, they must be bound to their rules and if 3% of students sign, it should go to a referendum. that is possibly a number that is too small, considering the amount of people who will just sign anything, but i'm glad to know i have the power to really change something in the msu.

and after reading the sra's position, and then the speaker's ruling, I can agree with it. if the sra, the elected representative body for the students, wants to take up an official position, i think it is their right, and almost their duty. our elected representatives should be the most work, research the issue and present the information to the students, along with their suggested choice.

and i'm just wondering, in what way were you (Nicole) forced into signing the petition? i don't doubt that it happened, i'm just curious about how, where, where, all that. thanks!

Originally Posted by micadjems

I would not have known about this were it not for this post. There is NOTHING around JHE, where I basically LIVE. Even if i checked websites, i wouldnt have heard anything. hey, yoohoo, MSU and stuff, if theres something important going on want to email us?
What about all the other engineers that DONT go on macinsiders? or even facebook?

I'm with micadjems, I would not have known about this issue were it not for the first Facebook group (and the kerfuffle that followed). I just checked ITB's poster boards by the department chair's office and there aren't any posters advertising the referendum (there is one advertising Quarters events though).

I'm glad we were able to get a discussion going, biased or not. Actually, all sides were able to give their input even though it was against the rules (at least until last night's EC meeting: "Well we can't beat them guys, let's join them and tell 'em we're ok with it now.")

Originally Posted by McIntyre

Just to correct some information provided. You say that there would be an opt out. Unfortunately that is not guaranteed, that is purely based on whether the MSU can work this into their agreement with the external organization.

ok, so i have to admit I'm a little confused. this is a "non-binding" referendum, and from what I can tell we aren't actually voting immediately on establishing the service? the referendum says that an opt-out plan may not work, some other aspects of it might change... and did it not say somewhere that we are merely voting on whether the msu should consider setting up this service?

so aren't we really just saying that we do/not want them to look into the possibility of a $24/year dvd rental service on campus? If it was found that no opt-out service was possible, and the msu decided students would be against a forced dvd rental service, could they end up not allowing it?

Originally Posted by DannyV

I'm glad we were able to get a discussion going, biased or not. Actually, all sides were able to give their input even though it was against the rules (at least until last night's EC meeting: "Well we can't beat them guys, let's join them and tell 'em we're ok with it now.")

I'm just wondering how else you wanted the elections committee to make that decision? they had past rules to follow, they initiated a referendum and then found mass amounts of people complaining, arguing free speech violations, people violating their rules on the internet...

the fact that they got together and revised their rules in order to provide a fair balanced referendum in such a quick time is very impressive. The internet as a forum for discussion and debate for the majority of people (as opposed to just a few people a few years back) is relatively new, and so the EC is now caught in a position of trying to still run all their elections, but have to constantly update bylaws and rules to keep up with changing technologies and social trends.

Hi Steven,

You are voting on whether you want to pay $24/year to establish a DVD access service on campus. If this is voted in favour of, with the 10% quorum reached then the MSU will have to establish this on campus. The information in the preface, however, is non-binding. The reason being is we are not allowed to consider a company before a referendum goes through, and afterwards we have to search for the best possible company to offer this service to students. As such, we do not know if the stuff listed in the preface (unlimited DVDs, opt-out, etc.) are going to be in the contract with the company we find if this goes through. However, the stuff listed in the preface will be in our criteria when rating different companies as that is what was presented in the petition. Hope this clears thigns up.

Cheers,
John McIntyre
Elections Committee Member

so I just passed a poster in BSB that had an interesting message on it...

it said vote no for the dvd referendum, because there is NO opt-out program, and NO accountability. the poster was from the SRA...

to me both those claims seem completely false. we don't know if there will be an opt-out program, one of the main issues the MSU will be investigating that exact possibility. also, the MSU could find a company that would agree to follow MSU guidelines, and run under the restrictions imposed by the MSU...

how did a poster like that be allowed up? even if the second claim is arguable, since there will never be complete accountability, the first must be seen as at the least a gross exaggeration of the truth...

Hi Steven,

I have contacted the CRO about your concern and am awaiting response. However, because there is nothing about an opt-out in the actual question since it cannot be guaranteed, the poster likely was approved - but I will look into it.

As for the lack of accountability - keep in mind both sides will be advocating their view points in a biased manner. The facts are that the MSU will not have authority over its operation, much like we don't for OPIRG (whereas with services like EFRT, SWHAT and COMPASS for example - the MSU has specific operating policies in place that govern those services).

Cheers,
John McIntyre
Elections Committee Member

Its up to the people reading the posters to look more into it.

And the people FOR the movies can put posters up too.

Originally Posted by McIntyre

As for the lack of accountability - keep in mind both sides will be advocating their view points in a biased manner. The facts are that the MSU will not have authority over its operation, much like we don't for OPIRG (whereas with services like EFRT, SWHAT and COMPASS for example - the MSU has specific operating policies in place that govern those services).

Yay Compass! Yes, incredibly off-topic...but I happen to like MSU services...not external corporations...

Originally Posted by micadjems

Its up to the people reading the posters to look more into it.

And the people FOR the movies can put posters up too.

Indeed, they have.