MacInsiders Logo

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Honours Chemistry or Honours Chemical Biology? (Undergrad) Porsche Academics 21 07-12-2010 02:25 AM
Honours Molecular Bio and Genetics vs. Honours Biology (Physiology Specialization) kritters91 Academics 4 06-10-2010 07:42 PM
Mirroring Honours Biology when in Honours Life Science mw11 Academics 1 05-30-2010 02:39 PM
Dean's and Provost's Honour Lists feonateresa General Discussion 20 11-19-2009 05:49 AM
Honours Life Science vs. Honours Psych Neuroscience & Behaviour mel89 Academics 0 08-20-2009 03:11 PM

Provost's Honours List

 
Old 03-02-2009
moi0000
This message has been removed by a moderator. .
Old 03-02-2009 at 04:48 PM   #106
C. Nardo
Member
Join Date: Jan 2009
Posts: 20

Thanked: 11 Times
Liked: 2 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by FireDragoonX View Post

c. nardo wrote that 3rd yr immuno is not a bird course.
I took that course in fall 07. It was a bird course, and it probably still is.
The averages for the midterms were both 80.
The class average in fall 06 (the year before I took it) was 80.
The course required much less work than all of my other courses. It is one of the easiest courses at mac.

(/sarcasm)
they restructured the class and have different teachers/topics this year. and i dont know too many ppl, incl health scis that rocked those midterms, we mostly all rocked the exam
Old 03-02-2009 at 06:06 PM   #107
clragon
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 5

Thanked: 0 Times
Liked: 0 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by micadjems View Post
Really? I would be so frustrated if I didn't know averages... I like to know where my mark is on the curve and if I have to work harder next time...
I usually ask my friends.

Quote:
Originally Posted by micadjems View Post
I just wonder why this kind of honour even exists when it seems so routine for health scis, that's all.
because it is still a huge achievement for a health sci. If there are 40 health sci recipients for this award that means there are 10 in each year. This means 10 out of 160 (or 180 for 2nd year and above) people in each year got this award. This is not a high number when you consider how high the requirements are for getting into the program.
Old 03-02-2009 at 06:19 PM   #108
lorend
MacInsiders VP
MacInsiders Staff
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,615

Thanked: 913 Times
Liked: 507 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by clragon View Post
This is not a high number when you consider how high the requirements are for getting into the program.
But I wouldn't comment on the standards of high schools. They are in no way the same. Just because you can't get a 92% a in School X doesn't mean you can get it at School Y. Hense, partially, why so many students see a drop in their grades in first year.
__________________
McMaster Combined Honours Cultural Studies & Critical Theory and Anthropology: 2008
McMaster Honours English with a minor in Indigenous Studies: 2010
Carleton University Masters of Arts in Canadian Studies: 2012 (expected)

We are people of this generation, bred in at least modest comfort, housed in universities, looking uncomfortably into the world we inherit. -- Port Huron Statement



Old 03-02-2009 at 06:24 PM   #109
clragon
Member
Join Date: Jul 2008
Posts: 5

Thanked: 0 Times
Liked: 0 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by lorend View Post
But I wouldn't comment on the standards of high schools. They are in no way the same. Just because you can't get a 92% a in School X doesn't mean you can get it at School Y. Hense, partially, why so many students see a drop in their grades in first year.
no, it is not the same. But it is by no means completely unrelated to marks in university.

But yes I agree with you that school definitely matters as I have observed that most people who do well in first year health sci took courses from private school, AP, or IB. It is probably because they learned the material before in high school. But more importantly, the fact that they came from a harder school and STILL managed to get a high enough average to get into health sci probably shows how smart / hard working they are. Their marks usually does not drop too much compared to high school.
Old 03-02-2009 at 09:54 PM   #110
Lois
Elite Member
Join Date: Jun 2008
Posts: 2,069

Thanked: 318 Times
Liked: 361 Times




In a lot of cases, high school marks != university marks. And I've heard stories of private schools that are notoriously bad for inflating marks... AP/IB/Private school doesn't necessarily make it 'harder' than a public school it just means that the school gets more funding.

Although, in the context of this thread, even though there's more of a standard at the university level, there's still a ton of irregularities between faculties and schools alike.
Old 03-02-2009 at 10:30 PM   #111
Woody
Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 14

Thanked: 9 Times
Liked: 0 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by micadjems View Post
Really? I would be so frustrated if I didn't know averages... I like to know where my mark is on the curve and if I have to work harder next time...
This idea of needing class averages to know where you stand and to compare yourself to others has come up a couple of times in this thread, and I don't think it has been addressed by anyone who does not buy into this. I can't speak for all health scis, but I think that our program does a great job at trying to get us to think beyond comparing our marks to other people. Relative performance can vary depending on who you compare yourself to, a more constant measure of improvement and success is absolute performance (not comparing your marks to anyone else).

If you ask me, constant mark comparisons and obsessions over marks take away from true education. Our program believes in this so much that we have a second year course where we are not given a mark at all the entire semester, we are just given feedback, and then ultimately a final grade. Is this not enough to convince you that our program's pedagogy (I know some people hate this word by now, sorry to use it) is different?
Old 03-02-2009 at 11:01 PM   #112
lorend
MacInsiders VP
MacInsiders Staff
Join Date: Jul 2007
Posts: 7,615

Thanked: 913 Times
Liked: 507 Times




@ Woody.

I disagree, I'd really love to get feedback in terms of where I stack up with the rest of my classmates. I'm in CSCT/Anthro/English/ISP. I have never gotten a class average for any of my courses, just vague comments like "pretty good", "good" "B range" etc.

We are told in first year English/CSCT that an average grade for essays is a C+. After that...we have no idea what an average grade is, and thus how we can compare ourselves with the rest of our peers.

Averages are helpful in the grand scheme of things when you apply for post-grad programs. Many of the letters of reference ask where the student falls in comparison to x amount of students over x amount of years.
__________________
McMaster Combined Honours Cultural Studies & Critical Theory and Anthropology: 2008
McMaster Honours English with a minor in Indigenous Studies: 2010
Carleton University Masters of Arts in Canadian Studies: 2012 (expected)

We are people of this generation, bred in at least modest comfort, housed in universities, looking uncomfortably into the world we inherit. -- Port Huron Statement



Old 03-02-2009 at 11:50 PM   #113
micadjems
Awesome Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,091

Thanked: 145 Times
Liked: 382 Times




I see that comparing marks is now a lower form of learning?

I like to know where I am on the curve to see if I'll pass a course.
Old 03-03-2009 at 12:01 AM   #114
moi0000
Member
Join Date: Mar 2009
Posts: 2

Thanked: 0 Times
Liked: 0 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by micadjems View Post
I see that comparing marks is now a lower form of learning?

I like to know where I am on the curve to see if I'll pass a course.
There are tons of scholarly resources that provide evidence of grades being detrimental to educational learning. They wouldn't base the whole philosophy of this program with nothing to back it up. This might be why I've never heard of a class average for a midterm/final in a single health science course. This isn't to say that grades don't matter. The faculty knows that grades matter but only because of the fact that there needs to be some sort of measure in place for evaluation mostly for grad schools.

A pass is a 50. If you have over 50, you'll pass the course. Why does it matter what marks others have? It's not like knowing will change your mark. It may motivate you, but if your mark was bad in the first place, that should be enough to motivate you regardless of whether "everyone else did bad as well."

Last edited by moi0000 : 03-03-2009 at 12:17 AM.
Old 03-03-2009 at 06:36 AM   #115
micadjems
Awesome Member
Join Date: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,091

Thanked: 145 Times
Liked: 382 Times




Not everyone shoots for 12s.

If everyone did poorly on a test as well, the curve will help me achieve an average mark.
Old 03-03-2009 at 08:20 AM   #116
FireDragoonX
Elite Member
Join Date: Oct 2006
Posts: 676

Thanked: 60 Times
Liked: 142 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by moi0000 View Post
There are tons of scholarly resources that provide evidence of grades being detrimental to educational learning. They wouldn't base the whole philosophy of this program with nothing to back it up. This might be why I've never heard of a class average for a midterm/final in a single health science course. This isn't to say that grades don't matter. The faculty knows that grades matter but only because of the fact that there needs to be some sort of measure in place for evaluation mostly for grad schools.
I heard that this was the excuse to why hth sci's are given inflated grades.
"Studies have shown grades hinder learning. And there are sources to back that up"

When I took hth sci 3i03, we had 3 short, 1-page assignments worth 10% of our mark. It was just a pass/fail thing. And the reasoning above was given to justify the pass/fail mark.

And it explains why grades ARE inflated in the program. It is just like saying, "Give them high marks so they don't worry".
Old 03-03-2009 at 07:28 PM   #117
McIntyre
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 277

Thanked: 134 Times
Liked: 182 Times




To try and steer away from the Health Sci bashing, as I have a lot of friends in Health Sci who are smart and deserve the marks that they work hard for, perhaps it would be beneficial for awards like this to go to the top few in each faculty? No matter what, no two faculties are going to have the same level of difficulty to obtain a certain average, and that's not to say one is easier and one is harder. But looking at Health Sci for a second, almost everyone in that program is very dedicated to and interested in medical sciences. People are obviously going to do better if they are interested in what they are doing. The amount of people in Science and Humanities that I have heard say "I hate what I'm doing", it's no wonder individual in Health Sci do well. However, I think it would be beneficial to look into a way to recognize the top performers in each faculty, as I believe that is more representative of the top performers at the University as a whole.
Old 03-03-2009 at 07:31 PM   #118
McIntyre
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2007
Posts: 277

Thanked: 134 Times
Liked: 182 Times




And just to add to what moi posted, I think one of the main reasons isn't personal satisfaction but so that grad schools and any professional schools can help differentiate strong candidates from the mass of applications they receive. I agree grades don't always show that - but if 90% of the people passed all of their courses, it would be difficult to determine in any way who actually understood what they learned. Although this system isn't perfect, generally you can't pull off high marks by not knowing anything.
Old 03-03-2009 at 08:46 PM   #119
Phoenix
Join Date: Mar 2008
Posts: 252

Thanked: 44 Times
Liked: 52 Times




Quote:
Originally Posted by McIntyre View Post
The amount of people in Science and Humanities that I have heard say "I hate what I'm doing", it's no wonder individual in Health Sci do well.

Not true, I love what I'm doing in Humanities, but I'm not getting 12's, I work as hard as I can. Plus not all Health Science students "love" what they are doing, some hate it just as other students.



Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off



McMaster University News and Information, Student-run Community, with topics ranging from Student Life, Advice, News, Events, and General Help.
Notice: The views and opinions expressed in this page are strictly those of the student(s) who authored the content. The contents of this page have not been reviewed or approved by McMaster University or the MSU (McMaster Students Union). Being a student-run community, all articles and discussion posts on MacInsiders are unofficial and it is therefore always recommended that you visit the official McMaster website for the most accurate up-to-date information.

Copyright © MacInsiders.com All Rights Reserved. No content can be re-used or re-published without permission. MacInsiders is a service of Fullerton Media Inc. | Created by Chad
Originally Powered by vBulletin®, Copyright © 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba vBulletin. All rights reserved. | Privacy | Terms