Originally Posted by kldv

I'm not entirely sure what we're supposed to be getting out of that, but that sounds like the same group that protests at army funerals.
If they weren't doing it in the name of Christianity, they would be doing it in the name of some other religion. If religion didn't exist, they would STILL be doing it.

I think its more the case with them of a VERY angry and charismatic patriarch who is able to bully nice people into agreeing with what he says to the point of turning them into monsters... kind of like Charles Manson. He uses religion as a tool to magnify fairly benign passages into hate. Although, I'm sure some would make the argument that superstition will always be the alternative to rational thought and that religion is itself a component of superstition, so a religious tone to such a group is the natural and eventual vehicle of their nuttery. The worst secular murderers throughout history still had a quasi-religious personality cult around them (Stalin, Pol Pot, Hitler, George Bush [jkz]).

Originally Posted by kldv

I'm not entirely sure what we're supposed to be getting out of that, but that sounds like the same group that protests at army funerals.
If they weren't doing it in the name of Christianity, they would be doing it in the name of some other religion. If religion didn't exist, they would STILL be doing it.

Exactly! that's the point. but the problem is that intolerance under religion is justified. You know why? It's because religion is untouchable. you're not supposed to criticize it because it's going to hurt people's feelings. the same act, if done under a different name, would quickly be denounced and rejected because it's an act of intolerance.
If you don't believe me, go turn on CNN or any other news outlet in north america. they give a voice to discrimination against gays, athiests or any other group as long as the guy criticizing it belongs to some religion, preferably Christianity. but if someone came out and said they believe in unicorns and the unicorn inside their head is telling them to hate on gays, you think they would be given a voice?

Originally Posted by gholitf

Exactly! that's the point. but the problem is that intolerance under religion is justified. You know why? It's because religion is untouchable. you're not supposed to criticize it because it's going to hurt people's feelings. the same act, if done under a different name, would quickly be denounced and rejected because it's an act of intolerance.
If you don't believe me, go turn on CNN or any other news outlet in north america. they give a voice to discrimination against gays, athiests or any other group as long as the guy criticizing it belongs to some religion, preferably Christianity. but if someone came out and said they believe in unicorns and the unicorn inside their head is telling them to hate on gays, you think they would be given a voice?

The problem is, that this is not tolerated at all. If you research it you will probably find it is a "church" of at most 10 people and is not in any way supported by the Churches in the area.
Using something like this as an example of the wrongs encouraged by religion is like using the transfer of HIV as an example of why gay sex is wrong. (aka HIV is still transferred in straight sex and a variety of other methods.)
If you're going to blame religion for accepting wrong things, you should stick with the Crusades.

Originally Posted by Afzal

But but but but...

"Ta panta en Christoi synesteken" ("In Christ all things hold together" or "All things cohere in Christ")

When McMaster was founded, it was a Baptist university.

Originally Posted by aaront

When McMaster was founded, it was a Baptist university.

I know, I was just saying

btw, thanks for the Calculate your marks site in the sig

Yes McMaster used to be a baptist school, but I wouldn't be surprised if they also used to only let white people in, if women were kept out of certain programs, etc. Things change and the university should be at the forefront of those changes.

I think we need to take the cross out of the university crest. Now I don't want them to be retroactively taken down, obviously that gets into a whole shitty issue of erasing history, but we need to move forward.

If we are going to keep some religion on campus (which I dont support), it should all be done through divinity college. No more prayer in the gym, it should all be in the divinity building. I had a really polite muslim girl wander into the video editing lab when I was alone in there and pray in there because it was quiet and she wouldnt be disturbed. I made sure to keep people from bothering her while she was praying, but it would be nicer if there was an actual established building to pray in, not just in the gym or sneaking into the video lab.

Originally Posted by Rossclot

If we are going to keep some religion on campus (which I dont support), it should all be done through divinity college. No more prayer in the gym, it should all be in the divinity building. I had a really polite muslim girl wander into the video editing lab when I was alone in there and pray in there because it was quiet and she wouldnt be disturbed. I made sure to keep people from bothering her while she was praying, but it would be nicer if there was an actual established building to pray in, not just in the gym or sneaking into the video lab.

There might be a few problems with that:

#1 Not sure if Divinity College Will allow it; Divinity college is affiliated with but separate from McMaster so in other words Student Affairs Division of the Admin or MSU don't have alot of power

#2 Not Sure if all the Muslims will want to pray there in a church. For Regular Everyday Prayers they are happy enough with their office in Wentworth Hall. Its the Friday Prayers that are the issue

#3 More Importantly not sure if there is adequate space to fit in the 200-300 people that show up for Friday Prayers. To Pray they need a flat open room, I'm assuming but wouldn't divinity college be shaped like a traditional church with Benches?

Gym is currently ideal, except when Athrec holds their event bookings and somehow fail to account for the fact that Friday's 1:30-2:30 is always prayer time and they have no other place. :S

@huzaifa47 : Yes, Divinity College has a bench style setup.

Friday Campus for Christ meetings would also not be able to fit in Divinity College with an average 150 people going to Friday night meetings. At the beginning of the school year even HSC 1A1 is barely capable of handling the number of people.

Some of the smaller groups may be able to fit in the chapel, but the layout is not ideal.
As well there are major time overlaps daily.

Trying to force religious activities into one small building is just not possible. Even if ONLY Christians were to use Divinity College, it just would not work. Now imagine all of the various religions there are on campus trying to fit in a building that was designed for a school of 200 students not at the same place at the same time.

Originally Posted by huzaifa47

Gym is currently ideal, except when Athrec holds their event bookings and somehow fail to account for the fact that Friday's 1:30-2:30 is always prayer time and they have no other place. :S

I legit just facepalmed irl.

ps: rossclot, i saw you the other day in mills, rofl.

you could say the architects of the school were very intelligent and thinking ahead

Originally Posted by lawleypop

...

ps: rossclot, i saw you the other day in mills, rofl...

You dont have to be so nervous, you can just ask me out. It's okay.

Stalker tip: I live in mills because I dont have my own computer.

im fine with religion being preached, but i seriously get annoyed when it is done in a way that tries to make you feel certain that THEIR god is correct

I always found it curious how we have a chapel on campus and yet only one member of clergy present who deoesnt use the chapel. i'd expect there to more clergy to both field questions and hold serviuces. of course then there would be the retribution from those who didn't realize how closely knit McMaster is to religion.

religion = root of all evil imho

Originally Posted by Rossclot

I realize this will sound weird, you will have to be a bit open and don't set your flame to auto. But walking around seeing the KGP everywhere makes me think of what if I was walking around and there were swastikas everywhere. I know it seems like a bit of a stretch. I am not saying that is what it is, it just makes me think of that.

Made me think of this article

Originally Posted by Rossclot

Religion is a private matter, and people should express it, but you shouldn't be allowed to have any sort of recruiting on campus the way KGP has done. It passes the line of intrusive. The KGP campaign I dont mind, just the chalking.

Why should your view on religious truth (that people should keep their religious truth private) privileged above others? I.e. Why is it not subject to its own rule? There is no reason to say "all religious truths should be kept to yourselves, except this one of course."