Originally Posted by Goce

This has proved much more tricky than previously thought. I always thought the cut-off was 9.6. 9/12=75% whilst 10/12=83%. That would make 9.5 a 79% while 9.6 is an 80%. After all, our grades are out of a 12 point scale. However, the last post pretty much quashes what I say since I am not in any sort of power position at Mac regarding the issue.

I think that's a common misconception about the grading system. It is indeed a 12 point scale, but you don't just divide your CA/SA by 12 to get the percentage: for instance, 4/12 = 0.33, but a 4 on the grade scale is 60-62% which is clearly not 0.33.

Soooo, to answer the original question: A CA/SA of 9.5 is considered an 80% according to the University (that's why your scholarship is renewed if you get that average). In terms of individual courses, an 80% is a 10. You only get decimals when dealing with averages.

Ya, for anyone still confused over the grading system, check out this page.

http://registrar.mcmaster.ca /calen...07/sec_143.htm

say for first year you didnt have a CA of 9.5 so u dont get the scholarship renewal in second year. but if you work hard and get a 9.5 average in second year, would you be able to get the scholarship back for third year or is it once its gone, its gone?

The short answer is no. See my earlier post quoted below.

Originally Posted by nh999

Unfortunately, I don't believe so. To my knowledge, as soon as you dip below a 9.5 SA, you lose your scholarship. For example if you get: yr 1 >9.5, yr 2=9.3, yr 3 >9.5, you already lost your scholarship in yr 2 so you won't get it back even though you got >9.5 in yr 3.

Quoted from Student Financial Aid & Scholarships:

IMPORTANT NOTICE: To All First Year Students Who Have Received a McMaster Entrance Award in September 2008:

Terms and Conditions of Award Retention
2008 Entrance Award Program

If you received a McMaster Entrance Award in September 2008, you need to be aware of the terms and conditions to retain your award.

[...]

To receive your second entrance award installment (in Sept. 2009):

• You must achieve a sessional average of 9.5, with no failures, on a minimum of 24 units ('full-time' status) in Level 1(2008-2009 fall/winter session).
• You must register for Level 2 (2008-2009 fall/winter session).
• Payment will be credited to your student account when you register for the next session in September. (Your second installment decision will appear on MUGSI by the end of July.

Please refer to the 2008-09 Undergraduate Calendar to review the terms and conditions for retention. Summer courses do not count towards your full-load course requirement.

I would just like to add something quick, as this is an issue that I addressed with a guidance councilor last year when discussing the same scholarship. According to her, a 9.5 is indeed an (approximate) 80% and is counted as such by the school. This is because when finalizing grades they do not use decimal points (you get either a 9 or a 10 for example) and instead the marks are rounded up or down.

So as a result an 80% is a 9.5 that, on a grade report, would be rounded to a 10. However when considering a SA decimals come into play and therefore the consideration for an 80%+ average starts at 9.5.


And, no, once you drop below a SA of 9.5 your scholarship is gone and cannot be regained regardless of future averages.

Sorry if I'm too late to answer this, but I'd like to clarify a few things in regards to Mac's 12 point system...it's a very, very flawed system...and you've all stumbled upon why.

First to make a correction:

I saw someone post that 9/12 is 75%. The problem with this assertion is that the 12 point scale does not range from 0-100...it ranges from 50 to 100. A grade of '0' is anything below 50. So getting a 1 is actually 50-52 (I think).

So it can be approximated linearly, if you start from 50. So technically, 9/12 is "75% of the way from 50 to 100." But this also is not quite true! Why? Because the GPA is only linear from 50 to 80...it then turns into exponential growth (approximately) for the remaining grades, 10,11 and 12 (To see this, note that a 12 is anything between 90 and 100%...this is '10 possible percentages' while a 1 is '50-52'...only 3).

This sudden shift in rate of growth is where the problem arises. Since the math involved in computing 'regressions' and all that sort of thing are complicated, they associated mark ranges to each of the numerical grades. These can be found here.

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So the ultimate question: Is 9.5 an 80? Or some kind of hybrid mark?

The answer is, because of this flaw, it is both...an 80 and a 78%.

1) A 9.5 is a GPA of 3.50, which corresponds to a grade of approximately 78%. This is used in terms of raw data...using only one course.

2) A 9.5 is actually an 80 as well. To see how, suppose I take two courses. In the first, I receive a final mark of 82%, and in the other I get a 78%. These naturally, average to 80% right? But in terms of McMaster's grades, I get a 10, and a 9...which average to 9.5.

In other words, McMaster's point system 'screws you over,' it underestimates your average. When you have an 80% average, instead of having a 10 average, you may have a 9.5.

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So in short when looking at a SINGLE course, a 10 is an 80%...any less is less.

But when doing things such as computing your average (things that involve multiple courses), all sorts of funny things start happening, if the grades cluster in the 9-12 range...so the registrar accepts a 9.5 as being a mark of 80% (as I demonstrated above with the 82 and 78% grades). So yes, for scholarships, the cut off is 9.5: 80%.


Hope that helps.